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Topic: Adding a multimeasure rest (Read 34232 times) previous topic - next topic

  • Bob
Adding a multimeasure rest
Ever wonder how to make a multi-measure rest?  Well, I figured it out, and it changed in Noteworthy 2, when they fixed that invisible notation feature so it doesn't take up any space.

Here's the workaround (as well as instructions for both versions on how to make multis):

1) Insert your appropriate amount of rests, bars.
2) Higlight them and set them to invisible.
3) Insert the following just before the first rest:

a) Insert the following text(without quotation marks) in Boxmarks, pt 10: "[]"
Set this to align center at the next note/bar line.  Position it at -1.

b) Insert another text line, using the Noteworthy font that your staff is using, pt 22.  This should contain the number of the multi.  Set this to align center at the next note/bar line.  Position it at 8.

4) In Noteworthy 2, add additional text labels before and after, as spacers.  They should preserve width and be very high (50ish or so), so they're not visible.  I used the word "spacer" and it seems to be the right length.

Hope this helps! :)

Edit:

For those who like the codes, here is a sample of a 4 measure rest.  User1 is Boxmarks, 10pt, and User2 is NWC2STDA, 22pt.  The staff metrics are NWC2STDA, 16pt:

Code: [Select · Download]
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|Text|Text:"[]"|Font:User1|Pos:-1|Justify:Center|Placement:AtNextNote
|Text|Text:"4"|Font:User2|Pos:8|Wide:Y|Justify:Center|Placement:AtNextNote
|Rest|Dur:Whole|Visibility:Never
|Text|Text:"spacer"|Font:PageSmallText|Pos:61|Wide:Y
|Bar|Visibility:Never
|Rest|Dur:Whole|Visibility:Never
|Bar|Visibility:Never
|Rest|Dur:Whole|Visibility:Never
|Bar|Visibility:Never
|Rest|Dur:Whole|Visibility:Never
|Bar
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End
  • Last Edit: 2007-05-06 12:44 am by Bob, Deranged Arranger

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #1
G'day Bob,
Kjeld Hansen has written a very good user tool for NWC2 to place multi bar rests.  It has several variables early in the script that are clearly marked so you can change the font, characters, and the vertical location.

This is useful if you have any of my *Dings suites as there are several MBR characters available.  See the attached example from SwingDings.

Kjelds user tool is available from the Scripto:

http://nwc-scriptorium.org/nwc2scripts_mbr.html

I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #2
Woah...I'm lost, sorry.  Can you walk me through how to use that?  I don't want to accidentally screw up my computer.  (I've done a lot of experimenting with Windows Me's system files on the last computer I used, and that was part of the reason I stopped using it.  Not every experiment worked, lol.)

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #3
G'day Bob,
umm, what part worries you?  There aren't really any system files involved, less you count installing fonts, but you've gat that part OK or you couldn't have installed Boxmarks.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #4
It's not really so much that I'm worried, it just looks like a lot to read (and to learn) and I am pretty busy transposing (or transcribing? Putting alto music on treble) for the quartet...we're replacing our violist with a third violin, since good violists don't exist and the one we've got is going off to college.  Now, I'm going to bed, and I'll look at that another day.  Sorry if I sound short right now; it's been a long day.

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #5
Bob, the Boxmark2 method can leave little gaps.  Lawrie's font has a spill-over that covers those up.

I created a multibar rest file that uses Lawrie's fonts.  You can download it from the Scriptorium, http://nwc-scriptorium.org/helpful.html

Look for Multibar_rests.nwc.

Instructions are in the file info, but just keep it open, and copy the appropriate hidden bars and visible text-based multi-bar rests into your song file. You'll need Lawrie's SwingDings font set up as UserFont 3, size 16 in the target file.

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #6
For user tools, the safest thing to start with would be the user tool starter kit, and then you would just add the Multibar-Rest script into the folder, I'm not sure if that would be too complex, the instructions are pretty clear.

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #7
Bob, the Boxmark2 method can leave little gaps.  Lawrie's font has a spill-over that covers those up.

I created a multibar rest file that uses Lawrie's fonts.  You can download it from the Scriptorium, http://nwc-scriptorium.org/helpful.html

Look for Multibar_rests.nwc.

Instructions are in the file info, but just keep it open, and copy the appropriate hidden bars and visible text-based multi-bar rests into your song file. You'll need Lawrie's SwingDings font set up as UserFont 3, size 16 in the target file.


Looks great!  I must say that I would prefer to see the numerical values above the rests in the same font as the staff, but that's easily fixed by changing to a user-defined font.  Thanks, everyone, for all the help, even if some of it confused me for a bit.

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #8
G'day Bob,

Looks great!  I must say that I would prefer to see the numerical values above the rests in the same font as the staff, but that's easily fixed by changing to a user-defined font.

That's why I created my fonts as suites.  Every font defined object required by NWC is available as a matching set with text characters, music symbols and chord elements.

If you want to use the standard NWC appearance, then Boxmark2 is the music symbol and rehearsal mark font of choice, otherwise I have a Serif, a Sans Serif and of course the original Swing/Jazz handwritten style alternative.

So, for example, if you're using NWC2 and you prefer the appearance of MusikDingsSerif, then you would select NWC2MusikDingsSerif as the notation font in:
|File|Page Setup|Fonts (tab)|Change (Button in "Staff Metrics")|Notation Typeface (drop down)|
This way everything matches.

Of course, if you're using NWC1.x then the substitution process is a little more unwieldy.  Instructions are in the suite doco.

Check the sample charts here:
https://forum.noteworthycomposer.com/?topic=5872.msg38388#msg38388
and you'll see the different notation fonts in action, along with their respective text, symbol and chord fonts.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #9
You wouldn't by chance have a font with those characters in a standard appearance, such that there isn't a gap, would you?  (Like in Palmquist's file, only not jazzy).

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #10
Unfortunately no, but if you use MusikDingsSerif for ALL the fonts...

NWC2MusikDingsSerif for notation
MusikTextSerif for the Staff Italic, Bold, Lyric; Page Title Text, Text and Small Text
MusikDingsSerif as a user font for the MBR's etc. and
MusikChordSerif as a user font for chords if you need 'em

It just might be close enough to suit you.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #11
That brings me to my next question...will you be creating another update to your font sets to integrate new exciting characters, or is this some technical difficulty that cannot be solved?

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #12
Depends, waddya want?

If you want additional glyphs let me know what they are.  I think the current suites cover the vast majority of requirements.

Current plans are for another Jazz type font, but to actually hand write it and scan it in rather than create onscreen...  Some of SwingDings was "borrowed" from (mostly) willing participants... ;)

It will be character compatible with the existing suites as will any future endeavors.  This is a self imposed limit that I hope won't bite me... :)

This next font is not yet even on the drawing board, but just a vague intention so it could be some time away yet.

SwingDings, MusikDingsSans and MusikDingsSerif are "set in concrete" except for the possibility that NWC2 may require additional glyphs in which case there will be updates for that.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #13
If you want additional glyphs let me know what they are. 
You might consider replacing the 64th note flags with slashed 8th note flags. The playback of grace notes is the same for all durations. Unbeamed 64th notes are much rarer than grace notes and can always be presented as text.
Registered user since 1996

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #14
If you want additional glyphs let me know what they are.
Actually, I was thinking it would be neat to see some of the old-fashioned multimeasure rests.  There are a few good examples in Polovetsian Dances.  The rest characters could eliminate the need for the multi.

Here are a few characters that may or may not already be in your font sets...I haven't checked yet.  I'd definitely like to see a regular style multi without gaps, like the 20 measure one shown below.

<Image Link>

Edit:
Actually not like that one in that the left line is a bit thicker than the right.  Both should be a thin line like the right one.

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #15
G'day Rick,
You might consider replacing the 64th note flags with slashed 8th note flags. The playback of grace notes is the same for all durations. Unbeamed 64th notes are much rarer than grace notes and can always be presented as text.

As mentioned elswhere, your argument is compelling, but I'm reluctant to make changes away from the standard glyphs for general consumption.  It's one thing to change the style of them, but quite another to change them altogether.

I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #16
G'day Bob,
the multi bar rest you want is already there.  Characters ":" and ";".  E.G the 20 bar rest in your example would be ":20;" - without the quotes of course.  If you wanted to extend the rest line you can use "-" in pairs thus: ":-20-;" - again, no quotes.

In fact, much of what you want is there: sfz, tremolo's, bar repeats, 2 bar repeats, staccatissimo, up and down bow, horn stop, open, breve (square and round, though not the rest), dashed barline.

The ones that are not there are:
quarter tone accidentals, breve rests, and the "slap".  Slash heads are available in NWC2, but only closed ones.

I didn't bother with 8va and 15ma as these are easily rendered as text.

Metronome marks are part of NWC already.

My main aim in producing the font suites was to be able to make good looking jazz charts.  Thus SwingDings was the first suite done.  It contains characters for making modern jazz charts clear and legible.  I didn't make much allowance for historical glyphs as there is little use for them in the jazz environment.  The charts must be clear and unambiguous.  Readable at a glance, but in a style that the jazz musician is comfortable with.

I produce a lot of charts for myself to use in church.  We have a huge reportoire, many of which I see less than once a year.  When I first started using NWC I simply used the default fonts and was relatively happy.  Then I started playing with fonts, and now I wouldn't go back to the more traditional forms by choice.  There is something about the handwritten appearance that makes charts much more readable - they HAVE to be neat of course, but the handwritten style feels much more comfortable.

So my aim was primarily for modern/common useage in a jazz setting.

MusikDingsSans and MusikDingsSerif were literally afterthoughts.  I did 'em 'cos I could.  NWC2HiVisLP was purpose built for a lady whose husband has a vision impairment.  Their popularity has amazed me.

Downloads as of today (allowing for 10% download managers):
SwingDings = 1218
MusikDingsSans = 479
MusikDingsSerif = 594
NWC2HiVisLP = 703

However, I think that better slash heads and the quarter tone accidentals are worthy of consideration.

The real difficulty I have with quarter tone accidentals is that there are many forms, not just the examples you have presented.  Which ones do I choose - who do I disappoint?  What are the most common ones?  I don't use 'em, the music I see never has 'em so I have no feel for which are common and which are not.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #17
the multi bar rest you want is already there.  Characters ":" and ";".  E.G the 20 bar rest in your example would be ":20;" - without the quotes of course.  If you wanted to extend the rest line you can use "-" in pairs thus: ":-20-;" - again, no quotes.
Urg...i knew that *grumbles sarcastically and slaps forehead*
Actually I didn't know that...I was looking at the wrong fonts, and was wondering to myself, "why would Lawrie make it right in the jazz notation and not in the regular?"  Apparantly I was overlooking MusikDingsSans.

Quote
In fact, much of what you want is there: sfz, tremolo's, bar repeats, 2 bar repeats, staccatissimo, up and down bow, horn stop, open, breve (square and round, though not the rest), dashed barline.
Thanks for checking those for me.  I was using a different computer that didn't have my files on it, or I would have checked myself.  Sorry to cost you any time there.

Quote
Metronome marks are part of NWC already.
??? Who said anything about those?  I didn't know there were such markings!

Quote
I produce a lot of charts for myself to use in church.  We have a huge reportoire, many of which I see less than once a year.
I'm one of those church musician/arranger people, too...glad to know my family isn't the only one that is on Noteworthy six days a week getting music ready for church!

Quote
However, I think that ... the quarter tone accidentals are worthy of consideration.
At first, I thought to myself, "That's stupid, why would I suggest characters for notating something the software is entirely incapable of playing?"  Then I remembered I've been using letters to represent trills without actually typing the notes in.  Then I remembered you can do a multi-point controller...

I'd actually like to experiment with quarter tones sometime in my compositions.  By the way, I noticed a few songs in the Scriptorium by people born in the 90's submitted by themselves.  Does that mean anyone can submit any music they darn well please?  Or does it go through some sort of a filter to see if it's worth sharing?

Back on topic...

Quote
The real difficulty I have with quarter tone accidentals is that there are many forms, not just the examples you have presented.  Which ones do I choose - who do I disappoint?  What are the most common ones?  I don't use 'em, the music I see never has 'em so I have no feel for which are common and which are not.
You know, I hadn't thought of that, partially because I've never seen a second style for quarter tones, and partially because I've never seen them in print until today when I was looking to see what markings were probably useful.  (Be glad that I didn't throw a bunch of outdated foreign note symbols at you...I thought about it, and then reconsidered when I saw they were out of date and the fact that probably the only people who would use them would be Renaissance music teachers!)

What do the other ones look like?

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #18
G'day Rick,
As mentioned elswhere, your argument is compelling, but I'm reluctant to make changes away from the standard glyphs for general consumption.  It's one thing to change the style of them, but quite another to change them altogether.



I'd definitely like to see some of those slashed grace notes, although there's no legitimate reason to replace the existing characters.  They should be made in a new font.

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #19
G'day Bob,
??? Who said anything about those?  I didn't know there were such markings!
Metronome marks are tempo indicators - you know, crotchet = 100 etc..  There was one in your example.

Quote
I'm one of those church musician/arranger people, too...glad to know my family isn't the only one that is on Noteworthy six days a week getting music ready for church!

You might be surprised how many of us are...

Quote
I'd actually like to experiment with quarter tones sometime in my compositions.  By the way, I noticed a few songs in the Scriptorium by people born in the 90's submitted by themselves.  Does that mean anyone can submit any music they darn well please?  Or does it go through some sort of a filter to see if it's worth sharing?

The only filtering I'm aware of on the Scripto is for copyright violation.  Though I imagine that Rich, the webmaster, may comment on something that was truly horrible...  ;)

Quote
Back on topic...
You know, I hadn't thought of that, partially because I've never seen a second style for quarter tones, and partially because I've never seen them in print until today when I was looking to see what markings were probably useful.  (Be glad that I didn't throw a bunch of outdated foreign note symbols at you...I thought about it, and then reconsidered when I saw they were out of date and the fact that probably the only people who would use them would be Renaissance music teachers!)

Thanks for taking pity on me!

Quote
What do the other ones look like?

I'm not completely familiar with them so I cannot describe them all, but some I've seen have little horzontal lines coming out from them - especially on the flats, though I'm sure I've seen 'em on sharps too.


I'd definitely like to see some of those slashed grace notes, although there's no legitimate reason to replace the existing characters.  They should be made in a new font.

There is a text one in each of the *Dings fonts.  It's up to Noteworthy Software of course, but there is room in the NWC system fonts to add a few little goodies like slashed grace note flags, though it is quite easy to simulate 'em too.  Place a normal grace note, then place a text slash of the appropriate size over it.

Please note - a decision by Noteworthy Software to modify the NWC system font is not trivial.  I would not expect them to do so without them feeling a compelling need directly related to program functionality.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #20
I'd definitely like to see some of those slashed grace notes, although there's no legitimate reason to replace the existing characters.  They should be made in a new font.
Ahem. NWC2 only supplies so many resources. Sometimes, to get the results you want, you have to use those resources in ways not originally intended. Please do not characterize my suggestions as illegitimate.
Registered user since 1996

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #21
Ahem. NWC2 only supplies so many resources. Sometimes, to get the results you want, you have to use those resources in ways not originally intended. Please do not characterize my suggestions as illegitimate.

I'm not saying your suggestion is illegitimate.  It just needs modification.  Put these characters in a different character code, like maybe the captial and lowercase umlaut I's or something.  Just don't put them in the exact same character spot as the existing ones that someone may want to use the same font for.

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #22
Umm Bob,
what Rick is up to is quite innovative given the restrictions he must work under.

The font in question is NOT a text font, it is the NWC sysem font itself.  In order for him to achieve the results he desires he MUST remap existing characters - there is simply no option in the current NWC environment.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #23
You might consider replacing the 64th note flags with slashed 8th note flags. The playback of grace notes is the same for all durations. Unbeamed 64th notes are much rarer than grace notes and can always be presented as text.

Actually, I believe he means, "If you should produce a new font, it should contain slashed 8th note flags in place of slashed 64th note flags."  This was in response to your offer to include new glyphs.

He's said nothing about modifying an existing font.

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #24
G'day Bob,
Actually, I believe he means, "If you should produce a new font, it should contain slashed 8th note flags in place of slashed 64th note flags."  This was in response to your offer to include new glyphs.

You are quite correct, nevertheless Rick is referring to a practice he has occasionally used of editing the NWC system font to produce specific results that are not obtainable any other way.

Quote
He's said nothing about modifying an existing font.

My NWC system fonts are modified alternatives to the existing NWC system font.

When Rick mentioned changing the flags, he was explicitly referring to the NWC system font as that is where those glyphs exist.  They are not defined in a text font.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next

  • Bob
Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #25
G'day Bob,
You are quite correct, nevertheless Rick is referring to a practice he has occasionally used of editing the NWC system font to produce specific results that are not obtainable any other way.

My NWC system fonts are modified alternatives to the existing NWC system font.

When Rick mentioned changing the flags, he was explicitly referring to the NWC system font as that is where those glyphs exist.  They are not defined in a text font.

So what you're saying is he replaces the NWCV15.ttf with a new font by the same name (or just edits that font).  Interesting idea.  I've noticed in NWC2 (I don't remember if 1 does this) that you can specify what font Noteworthy should use, so you can switch between your standard, jazz, and visually-impaired fonts at a couple of clicks without keeping fonts in separate folders.  Noteworthy deserves a big thank-you for that one!

Re: Adding a multimeasure rest
Reply #26
Actually, I believe Rick predominately works in NWC2 these days...  You will have noticed from my font suites that there are replacements for NWCv15.ttf included.

This discussion has really moved away from being a tip - perhaps if you want to continue exploring it we should create a new topic in one of the other boards...
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals 'n youfonymums - gonna lern tubies next