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Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

I just installed version 2.1.  Quick first impression very nice.  Great job.  I like the staff label panel, LOVE the piano bar.  I usually use keyboard method to enter notes (keying is quicker and easier for me than using the mouse), but might use piano bar for chord entry.  It's also fun to watch during playback.

There're still a couple things I long for, though.  The other day I imported a midi file in G minor that had a lot of D7 - Gm cadences.  Needless to say, I had a score full of G-flats followed by notated G-naturals.  Since the key signature contained flats, Audit Enharmonic Spelling had no effect.  And I wasn't terribly interested in manually fixing all the F#s and clearing all the natural signs. 

What would be helpful would be an Enharmonic Spelling toggle that could be applied to a single selected note.  That would make editing the Gbs to F#s easier and then I could use accidental audit to clear the natural signs.  I don't know how much development would be involved, but I bet you could reuse a lot of the code already designed in the staff enharmonic audit module as a starting point.

The other feature I would find useful would be a double whole-note.  An assignable time duration would be nice for free meter notation, but I'd settle for a set 8-quarter-note duration.  I made my own organ arrangement of Barber's Adagio 15 years ago.  Pencil and paper.  The meter is 4/2 with lots of double whole notes.  Went to enter into NWC for clean printout and midi and had to settle for using tied whole notes.

Just wishin'.  But seriously, 2.1 is good work.

Jim
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #1
G'day Jim,
There're still a couple things I long for, though.  The other day I imported a midi file in G minor that had a lot of D7 - Gm cadences.  Needless to say, I had a score full of G-flats followed by notated G-naturals.  Since the key signature contained flats, Audit Enharmonic Spelling had no effect.  And I wasn't terribly interested in manually fixing all the F#s and clearing all the natural signs. 

What would be helpful would be an Enharmonic Spelling toggle that could be applied to a single selected note.  That would make editing the Gbs to F#s easier and then I could use accidental audit to clear the natural signs.  I don't know how much development would be involved, but I bet you could reuse a lot of the code already designed in the staff enharmonic audit module as a starting point.

You should explore user tools.  For example, the Global_Mod tool could easily be used to fix them.  The Global_Mod command:
Note,Pos==-2 Pos=#-3
will convert all single notes on the second line to sharp notes on the first space.  On a treble clef this would be G to F# - as the G is flattened by the key sig then this will work for you.  An accidental audit will then remove the naturals of the G's that must remain.

Quote
The other feature I would find useful would be a double whole-note.  An assignable time duration would be nice for free meter notation, but I'd settle for a set 8-quarter-note duration.  I made my own organ arrangement of Barber's Adagio 15 years ago.  Pencil and paper.  The meter is 4/2 with lots of double whole notes.  Went to enter into NWC for clean printout and midi and had to settle for using tied whole notes.

This can be done with tied wholes made print never, with a text entry from either Boxmark2 or one of my font suites (in the PardyPack supplied with your CD) added to the bar - select alignment to suit yourself.

Imperfect solution I know, but it will print fine.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #2
Thanks, Lawrie.  I will definitely explore the user tools.  Global command editing sounds worth the learning time. 

I'll have to think about how badly I want to apply the double whole note solution, though.  It would require quite a bit of effort.  There are four pages of tied double whole notes in chords with meter changes (4/2, 5/2, and 6/2), staff changes and moving slurred quarter note lines on the same staff.  Do you know the piece?  Lush and beautiful, slow and sustained.  Was used extensively in Platoon, I believe.

Funny story about my work on arranging the piece.  I checked out the orchestral score from the library and brought it home to work on as a project to keep myself busy after I got sober in the early nineties.  Of course, the viola and cello parts had alto and tenor C clef notation and I was converting to two hands and pedal for organ.  I was working on the final section when I heard the piece play on the radio.  Already arranged for organ solo!  Had been done by a fellow named Strickland decades before and was still commercially available in print.  Shoulda' known someone would have already thought of it and done it.  It was a piece that just begged for organ transcription.  Well, I finished it anyway.  And I have to say I like my version better.  Not just because I did all that work, but my arrangement is easier.  I drop the pedal out two phrases earlier, and I like my voicing choices better in some spots.  Some adjustments were necessary to make the notes fit within finger reach on the keyboard.

I know I'm just blathering on, but I love music, computers, and arranging music, and notation software brings it all together in a very special way.  So I spend a lot of time using these tools and playing for church and my own amusement.

Take care.  I have more NWC project stories to share.  May post more soon.

(Though I'd still like to see these two ideas incorporated into the application.)

Jim
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #3
   Hi, Jim.

   A year or so ago I remember someone posting a tip in the Forum about changing Sharps to Flats and vice versa.  I cannot find the original tip, and I would like to suggest that he/she repeat it, perhaps with whatever updates and expansions and explanations may be appropriate - and especially perhaps with some Noddy-level comments about how and why things are the way they are (although possibly only Eric knows why NWC works the way it does)!  Meanwhile ...

   I am not sufficient of a musician to understand the rules etc involved in this - and particularly how NWC applies them when using the transpose and enharmonic spelling tools, but so far as I can see what one needs to do - and what I recall the original tip saying - is as follows:-


   To convert Sharps to Flats:

1)   If necessary insert key signature.

2)   Transpose UP two semitones, favouring Flats.

3)   Use Enharmonic Spelling tool.

4)   Transpose DOWN two semitones, again favouring Flats.  Voila!


   And to convert Flats to Sharps (is almost the opposite):-

1)   If necessary insert key signature.

2)   Transpose DOWN two semitones, MINIMIZING Sharps/Flats.

3)   Use Enharmonic Spelling tool.

4)   Transpose UP two semitones, again MINIMIZING Sharps/Flats.  Voila!


   It is strange how transposing up or down only one semitone gives different results, as does not favouring (or not) the right accidental.

   I have found this tip - or possibly my interpretation of the tip - invaluable when, as seems often to be the case, I've "imported" in a Midi File which seems to use the "wrong" accidentals (or at least which NWC converts into a File with notes with the "wrong" accidentals); it's such a pain to change everything by hand.  Mind you, just now and again the conversion doesn't seem to work the way I expect ... probably because I have myself done something wrong.

   Regards,

   MusicJohn, 18/Apr/10

PS   Richard: you will recognise this!


Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #4
G'day Jim,
I'll have to think about how badly I want to apply the double whole note solution, though.  It would require quite a bit of effort.  There are four pages of tied double whole notes in chords with meter changes (4/2, 5/2, and 6/2), staff changes and moving slurred quarter note lines on the same staff.

Do it once and copy and paste..?  Use <Ctrl+Shift+Up/DownArrow> to adjust the vertical position.

Liked the story :)
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #5
Tried to answer earlier, but my network burped just I was posting and I lost the whole message.  GRRRRRRR!

So I typed into a text file and will paste:


Thanks for the transposing trick recommendation.  I found that post the day I was working with the MIDI file, tried it a few times, and the G-flats always reappeared, even if I went to a key with sharps and back.  So no luck there.  Global edit sounds like the right answer for this.

I love your "youfonymums" tagline.  I played t-bone in high school.  Used to like to try other instruments in the band closet.  Could actually get music out of single reeds, and other low brass.  Couldn't pucker enough for the trumpet.  Couldn't get above high G on the clarinet.  Getting an in-tune scale out of a French horn made for a good day.  My favorite "exercise" was to play Londonderry Air on as many instruments as possible.  Could never get the high A to sound on the clarinet, though.

Really liked playing baritone horn/euphonium.  Mellower sound than the trombone.  We had a concert march piece entitled "Coat of Arms" that had a killer baritone part.  It was an interesting counter melody to the treble and was a blast to play because it could stand alone and didn't sound like a "low brass" part.

As an adult, I pretty much just play keyboard.  I have an electronic piano and just got a new (used) Conn 716 organ off of Ebay for $500.  'Course it cost $600 to ship cross country but my old instrument was dying and would have cost thousands to fix.  It was a Conn, too, and Conn stopped making organs probably 30 years ago.  So, I think I got a good deal.

Let me know if you'd like to hear the Adagio.  I don't think it public domain yet, so I can't post to the Scriptorioum, but could email for private use I think.

Take care.
Jim

P.S.  Still hope NWS will consider my requests.  May post on their site, too.
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #6
Hi Jim,

I too took a recent interest in Adagio For Strings - I was arranging it for handbells myself.  My first step was to enter the original score into NWC, before transposing out the alto clef and merging all 7 parts into a single treble/bass pair.  The attached is as far as I got on the original before getting distracted by other things.

Lawrie,

How can one get a tie from a "text" double whole note to a following quarter note, as in measures 1 and 2 of the Violin I part, even if one did want to use layers to split out the audio and visual aspects of the piece?

Randy

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #7
How can one get a tie from a "text" double whole note to a following quarter note, as in measures 1 and 2 of the Violin I part
Quote
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|Clef|Type:Treble
|Key|Signature:Bb,Eb,Ab,Db,Gb
|TimeSig|Signature:4/2
|Rest|Dur:Whole
|Note|Dur:Whole|Pos:-2
|Bar
|Note|Dur:Whole|Pos:-3^
|Rest|Dur:Whole|Visibility:Never
|Bar
|Note|Dur:Whole|Pos:-3^|Opts:Stem=Up
|Note|Dur:4th|Pos:-3
|Note|Dur:Half,Slur|Pos:-4
|Note|Dur:4th|Pos:-5
|Bar
|TimeSig|Signature:5/2
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End
But there are many other problems to solve. The ability to hide ties would be a big step forward.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #8
I guess I'm in the same boat as Jim Jr. I've used NWC since around version 1.3, but I just upgraded to NWC 2.1 today. I love the interface changes, but have a couple of suggestions for future versions:

1) I often use NWC as an accompanist for private practice. In that mode, NWC plays an accompaniment part and I play the solo part from a muted staff. This works fine, but because NWC's interface doesn't move the notes until it reaches the end of the page, it makes it difficult to read ahead. Is there any likelihood that you will add some sort of sliding playback window to future interfaces. If that is not practical, perhaps a setting to "turn the page" a measure or two before the end of the screen would help.

2) Is there possiblity of NWC including a piano clef that would combine a treble and bass clef system onto a single channel. I know you can have two or more systems share the same MIDI channel, but often it would be useful to just be able to put al the keyboard parts on a single group (for purposes of transposing, or pedal marks, etc.)..

Thanks,

Jim Mc.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #9
G'day Randy,
How can one get a tie from a "text" double whole note to a following quarter note, as in measures 1 and 2 of the Violin I part, even if one did want to use layers to split out the audio and visual aspects of the piece?

Took a little thinking...
Place a headless whole note with a tie attribute, follow with a whole rest, the bar line and then the quarter.
Now, set a user font to the appropriate font (Boxmark2 or one of my *Dings fonts) set to the requried size and place the text entry - I found right justified at next note|bar gave the best positioning for the tie, and finally move the rest off the page - Global_Mod command: Rest Opts.VertOffset=2000

Using Boxmark2 as User1:
Code: [Select · Download]
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|Text|Text:"°"|Font:User1|Pos:3|Justify:Right|Placement:AtNextNote
|Note|Dur:Whole|Pos:0z^
|Rest|Dur:Whole|Opts:VertOffset=2000
|Bar
|Note|Dur:4th|Pos:0
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End

Using a *Dings font as User1:
Code: [Select · Download]
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|Text|Text:"°"|Font:User1|Pos:1|Justify:Right|Placement:AtNextNote
|Note|Dur:Whole|Pos:0z^
|Rest|Dur:Whole|Opts:VertOffset=2000
|Bar
|Note|Dur:4th|Pos:0
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End


I note Rick posted almost the same solution while I was preparing this one.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #10

   Hi again, Jim.

   You say "Thanks for the transposing trick recommendation.  I found that post the day I was working with the MIDI file, tried it a few times, and the G-flats always reappeared, even if I went to a key with sharps and back.  So no luck there."

   Hmmm.  Well, it works for me.  With a treble clef, try this:-

Start from g minor key sig: key in G A B C D Enat F# G F E D C B A G  (a harmonic scale)

Convert to Midi, and then import.  You should get

           g minor key sig:        G A B C D Enat Gb Gnat F E D C B A G

This is what you don't want, so transpose down 2 semitones, minimizing accents in key.  This should give you

           f minor key sig:        F G A B C Dnat Fb Fnat E D C B A G F

Audit enharmonic spelling, and you should get

           f minor key sig:        F G A B C Dnat Enat F E D C B A G F

Transpose up 2 semitones, minimizing accents in key, and ... you're back where you started -

           g minor key sig: key in G A B C D Enat F# G F E D C B A G

        So, "midi" flats have been converted back to "NWC" sharps, which is what you wanted.

   Regards,

   MusicJohn, 18/Apr/10

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #11

Wow.  Guess I started something.  And it is going to bring out the diverse usage that any notation application must try to satisfy.  I am going to ramble a bit, but I will eventually hit all the issues.  I, myself, use NWC to may different ends and with different methods to achieve those ends.

The first big divergence is whether I want make a nice printout or generate a sound file.  Or both.  And why.

I submitted three arrangements of Schubert's Ave Maria to the scriptorium in December.  Only two got posted and I believe that failed to serve all the needs I intended to address for potential downloaders.  I submitted a piano/vocal version that could play as midi and serve satisfactorily as sheet music.  I submitted an organ version with standard midi with repeats and registration instructions for first time  and second time that printed on 3 pages and was primarily for use as sheet music for working organists.  I submitted a another organ version for listening with the Jeux organ sound font where I removed the repeat and did a copy/paste of the repeated section with a new "instrument" setting to aurally demonstrate how the repeated section could sound following the written organ registrations in the version with the repeat signs.  This version was not intended for printing as it would be 5 or six pages with the same written music printed twice.   Much more inconvenient to play from at the organ bench. 

The second version of the Schubert, general midi, with the repeat and only three printed pages was never posted depsite a repeated request to the site adminstrator.  I didn't press any further because I did get it posted on the Werner Icking Archive in a 3 page pdf, standard midi (posting requirement at WIMA), and an mp3 of the Jeux font rendered through SynthFont.   I don't have an SB card, but copied the patch numbers displayed in SynthFont to create the separate Jeux midi for the Scriptorium.  I haven't heard that it doesn't play properly, so I guess either the software/manual patch entry fakeout worked, or nobody was interested in listening to the file in the first place.

Then, there's choral arranging.  I really appreciate the functionality provided by a good notation application here.  I create a standard four staff vocal score with piano acc. for the singers and the director.  Then copy, save as, layer, tranpose the tenor to bass cleff, layer, save, print and there's a two staff version for the accompanist's convenience.  ( I was  often the accomp. and I just can't manage reading four staves.  Never could.)  Need it tranposed because we don't have a soprano with high A?  Give me 5 minutes.  Done!  Love it.


Now, more organ transcription.  Specifically, the Barber Adagio.  Lovely, long sustained chords originally the 2nd movement of a string Quartet in B minor.  Written in 4/2 with changes to 5/2 and 6/2 and back along the way.  Not quite sure if the 5-flat key signature is D flat major or B flat minor and how either relates to the B minor key name of the work, but now I digress. 


I originally wrote this out in about 1991 by hand directly to three organ staves, transposing and voicing as I went along after marking up a photocopy of the orchestral score with a lot of pencil notes. (The composer himself aranged the movement for string orchestra with basses doubling the cellos till cellos take the melody building up to the climax.  He also did a choral arrangement to the text "Agnus Dei".  Also lovely, but requires a really good large choir.)  Anyway, I've used this handwrriten copy a lot, and it is yellowing and fading and cracking, so I decided to get it in the computer a couple years ago so I could get a fresh paper copy.  I don't really intend to go back and rework it because it's done and I don't want to mess with it.  I can live with it as it is and have other projects to spend my time on.  Just thought I would mention to NWSoftware that I would like to see double whole notes available some time in the future.  Variable duration for proper free meter notation would be nice, but that would probably be really hard to develop.  I'm a computer programmer myself, and would not know how to approach that notion.

Alternatively, I downloaded a "keyboard" arrangement from the internet with the meter changed to 4/4 (5/4, 6/4) and transposed to a simpler key.  It also had lots of errors, but it was free and sounds good on electric keyboard with strings or string pad.  Just got the whiteout and fixed it by hand since I know the work so well.

I have two NWC files for this work.  One for printing another for playing through midi with some alterations to make up for the fact that I use the sub-octave coupler on the organ for the last section, so I didn't notate the octave doubling by the violas for the printout, but needed to add it for the sound file.


Randy, I'm sharing both files so you can see what I did.  Hope they help. 

I have done some other really neat things that I'll save for another time.  I' tired of typing, so will post this and pick up again later.  I'm on vacation from my day job this week.

Jim


[attachment deleted by user]
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #12
Hey, MusicJohn,

Thanks.  Hadn't read your reply when I posted answering Lawrie.  I just pasted, posted and kinda logged back off.  Now that I've read both your posts (after answering Randy's), I think I either didn't get the part about auditing in the intermediate key, or made a bad key choice.  I did this all a few weeks back and just wrote about it yesterday after upgrading to 2.1 and seeing the neat stuff I saw and mentioning a few things I'd still like to see come out of development.

I will revisit the workaround, and see where f minor gets me.  I also still want to get some experience with global editing under my belt. 

But I will stand by my idea of being able to apply the enharmonic audit at the note level as a legitimate, reasonable development request and I sumbitted it on the NWSI wish list page.

I also have a lot more to say about the diverse user community, and I'm only one cog amongst lots of wheels.

Maybe I should start a new thread with that topic.

Thanks again, Jim
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #13
Randy,

Another suggestion for you is to just throw out the double bass line.  It just doubles the cello line.



A detail I omitted about the Adagio tonal center

Quote
Specifically, the Barber Adagio.  Lovely, long sustained chords originally the 2nd movement of a string Quartet in B minor.  Written in 4/2 with changes to 5/2 and 6/2 and back along the way.  Not quite sure if the 5-flat key signature is D flat major or B flat minor and how either relates to the B minor key name of the work, but now I digress

To add further confusion, the work begins and ends around an F major chord!  Though the body of the piece seems more centered around B flat minor.  I tell ya, these modern composers...... 
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #14
I submitted three arrangements of Schubert's Ave Maria to the scriptorium in December.  Only two got posted and I believe that failed to serve all the needs I intended to address for potential downloaders.    ....  

I think there must have been some sort of misunderstanding here.

Your original email to me had a zip file with two versions of Ave Maria.  For one of them you wrote :
Quote
I have rendered with Jeux 1.4 and English Organ sound fonts using SynthFont but am unsure how to enter the bank and preset numbers in NWC file.  Registration suggestions included.


A day later you sent another email in which you said :
Quote
I think I figured out how to use the Jeux ITree.  Here is a file for Jeux 1.4 font, but someone should preview it before posting--someone who has a SB card with the true font loaded.


I reviewed the music file and it looked OK to  me and so I replaced the original one.

On Christmas day you wrote :

Quote
I just wanted to mention that the general MIDI version was not actually spurious.  It is better for printing because it has a repeat and fits on 3 pages whereas the Jeux version is for listening with the repeated section expanded to accommodate voicing changes.
I have also posted that version on the Werner Icking Archive.  It is up to you whether include on the Scriptorium with the following edited comment section:


There then followed an updated comments section which I replaced in the info file on the Scriptorium.

As far as I am aware, there has never been a third nwc file from you for Ave Maria unless the one that you sent on its own was not meant to be a replacement for the Jeux version. 

If you have a third nwc file of Ave Maria, please do send it to me together with its associated  info file and I will be happy to publish it. But for info,  the version posted on the Werner Icking Archive was presumably an actual midi file extract from an nwc file? The Scriptorium does not host midi files so if this is the third file you mention, that would explain it - however - it was not in your email anyway ?

I'm a bit puzzled.

Rich.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #15
Rick and Lawrie,

I never would have guessed that a tied note would continue to play through a rest that was inserted between the tied notes!  I guess this reminds me now of the old "stuck note" problem, where a tied note can play endlessly, searching for a companion note to put it out of its (and our) misery.  :-)

Having solved what I thought was the tougher problem, is there an equally easy solution to when the two tied whole notes are *not*  tied on into a third note?  I see now this is where being able to hide a tie (or having it automatically hide when its receiver is hidden) would be helpful.

Jim,

Quote
Another suggestion for you is to just throw out the double bass line.  It just doubles the cello line.

Well, it doubles it sometimes, but not others.  And even when it doubles, it jumps octaves sometimes, although this might be a range problem with the double bass, rather than a specific effect wanted by the composer?  The doubling will probably fall out anyway when I go to handbells, since we have only 4 octaves worth, but I still wanted it in the original anyway.

By the way, I couldn't see your NWC file, as it is in the old 1.75 format, and I only have 2.1 (and 2.0) installed now.  :-)

Randy

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #16
By the way, I couldn't see your NWC file, as it is in the old 1.75 format, and I only have 2.1 (and 2.0) installed now.  :-)

Randy

That shouldn't make any difference. Version 2.x  will read and play any older version files without problem.
Rich.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #17
Randy

That shouldn't make any difference. Version 2.x  will read and play any older version files without problem.

That's what I thought too, but I got this error when trying to load it!

This is a version '1.75' file, which is from a newer version of this application. It cannot be loaded using this application version.


Upon further inspection, I see now that instead of using my active 2.1 NWC session, the forum browser spawned a new 1.7 NWC session!  Anyone know what "registry" entry (or similar such nonsense :-) I need to fix (and how) to update this?
I don't even remember installing 1.7 on this computer!

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #18
Having solved what I thought was the tougher problem, is there an equally easy solution to when the two tied whole notes are *not*  tied on into a third note?  I see now this is where being able to hide a tie (or having it automatically hide when its receiver is hidden) would be helpful.
set Visibility Never on the note that the tie starts from...  Or both.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #19
Quote
set Visibility Never on the note that the tie starts from...  Or both.

That's the easy part.  But hiding the "real" first whole note put me in the world of needing a font to add back a "fake" text whole note for display purposes.  I've resisted figuring out how to install and use new fonts, but perhaps I should learn.  Is there a whole note in standard NWCV15 or NWC2STDA?  Or do I really have to install a new font?  Perhaps instead of adding simple vertical bars before and after a whole note (real or fake), I should look into font "nwslur" (I think that's what it was) that I found in searching the forum is puported to have a real breve symbol.  Does making use of a non-standard font cause a NWC file to become non-portable, that is, will someone else have to install the font too in order to see it properly?  Forgive my font ignorance please.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #20
Installing fonts for this task is no problem - plus you get the bonus of access to my font suites for other stuff too. ;)

Go here:
http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/uc/pardypack/
and download the installer - run it and the fonts are installed - no problems.

The Breve is in the title font of each suite (E.G. MusikDingsSerif.ttf) in the <Alt+0176> location which is the ° character.

Having installed the pack, simply select the font as a User font in page setup and then place the text entry using that font.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #21
Upon further inspection, I see now that instead of using my active 2.1 NWC session, the forum browser spawned a new 1.7 NWC session!  Anyone know what "registry" entry (or similar such nonsense :-) I need to fix (and how) to update this?
I don't even remember installing 1.7 on this computer!

 But if it actually spawned a 1.7 version, it must mean that you have 1.7 installed on your computer. I think that I would first look at Control panel / Programs and features to see if I could see how many "NoteWorthys" were installed.  Perhaps the easiest thing to try at first is to uninstall any version that does NOT say NoteWorthy Composer 2.

Rich.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #22
Hey, Richard,

I think I see what happened in December.  I didn't send all three file sets together. I hadn't figured out how to generate the Jeux file without actually having an SB card.  So, I sent two file sets first and when I got soundfont thing figured out, I sent the third set separately the next day or so.

The first submission contained two files:  (set #1, nwc and midi) the piano/vocal version, and the general midi organ file (set #2, nwc and midi).  Then I send the the third file (Jeux nww and midi-set #3) separately and only the file names were the easily distinguishably different.  The comments were somehat different, but I bet they appeard to be the same at a casual glance.  So #1 and #3 got posted and #2 and got left out.

I'm sorry about the confusion.  I tried to explain it clearly when I submitted, but obviously I didn't.  Also, it was the holiday season and you probably saw the emails all at once along with all your other communications. 

I didn't mean to put on you on the defensive like that.  The posting narrative was actually incidental to my larger point about generating multiple NWC versions of the same piece to achieve different purposes. 

Please accept my apology for any offense.  The description of the file formats I sent to WIMA was informational only.  I sent WIMA pdf, mid, and mp3.  I sent you three sets of mid and nwc in two separate emails and you must have believed #2 and #3 to be duplicate.  Then on 12/25 I asked you what happened to set #2)?  And you probably thought I was just crazy.

Would it be acceptable if I sent the general midi/nwc set later this week?  And, again, mea culpa.

Jim
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list--Adagio NWC version

Reply #23
Randy and Richard,

I didn't think to mention that the Adagio files were NWC 1.75.  Those files were from 2005 and I just finally upgraded to 2.0 last fall when I bought my laptop and all the wireless toys.  The plateau of my brain is shrinking and more stuff is falling off the cliff into the abyss.  : )

Jim
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #24
Hey, Richard,
... snip ...
Would it be acceptable if I sent the general midi/nwc set later this week?  And, again, mea culpa.

Yes - please do. But I would ask that you first look at the entries in the Scripto together with the info files and decide what needs to be changed, what needs to be added etc and then send me an email letting me know exactly what you would like changed/added.
Please note that the file names may have changed from your original submissions.

Sorry there has been some confusion over your submissions but glad we can get it sorted.


Rich.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list--Adagio NWC version

Reply #25
The plateau of my brain is shrinking and more stuff is falling off the cliff into the abyss.  : )

Great image, Jim. I feel that way myself too much of the time.

Bill

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #26
Quote
Perhaps the easiest thing to try at first is to uninstall any version that does NOT say NoteWorthy Composer 2.

Well it was easy to find and uninstall the NWC 1.7 that I had lying around, but now the "nwc" file extension has gone from being associated with NWC 1.7 to being associated with nothing!  Anyone know how to get it associated with my NWC 2.1?  If an uninstall/reinstall of NWC 2.1 is really necessary, will I lose any data in doing so?

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #27
Try to open any NWC file. When you get a message like "What program do I use to open this?", look for nwc2.exe in Program Files(x86)\NoteWorthy Software\Noteworthy Composer 2 and keep it as the default (Always open with ...).  That should avoid the reinstall.  HTH
Since 1998

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #28
Also, I would re-install (or install if you do not have it) the NoteWorthy Viewer.

Installation of the Viewer has been known to fix many registry association problems.
Rich.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #29
Thanks Warren and Richard,

The trick was to double-click on a NWC file in Windows Explorer (i.e. not in Internet Explorer, no pun intended).  In IE, it would not give me the chance to choose an app from a list, let alone establish a permanent association.  In WE, I could choose NWC2 for the "nwc" extension, and make it permanent.  Then double-click on nwc file in WE, or in IE (i.e. this forum), spawns NWC2 for me now.  I already had the viewer installed, so it was good to avoid uninstall/reinstall of either NWC2 or NWC2 Viewer for this!

I am still sorting through which font is best for implementing a double-whole note.  Again, is a NWC file "portable" regardless of user font chosen?  Can someone without the non-standard font installed still view an NWC file created with that font installed, or will they have to install it too?  I am writing a user tool to find and "repair" double-whole note emulations, and I want to use the best solution for double-whole note display.

Randy

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #30
  Again, is a NWC file "portable" regardless of user font chosen?  Can someone without the non-standard font installed still view an NWC file created with that font installed, or will they have to install it too?

Custom user fonts need to be installed on the PC that will be used to view the file.  The fonts themselves are not part of NWC.  I have opened files from others that use custom fonts that I did not have installed on my PC and result was the display of the text characters entered instead of the desired glyph.

The good news is a font only needs to be installed once on a PC, and the font association on the page setup IS part of the NWC file so that is portable.

Good luck. 
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #31
If font availability is a concern, you can always put the details of the required fonts in the comments section of the Authoring Info <Ctrl+I> box...
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #32
All,

I got the global edit to work but with a couple issues.

First, I copied and pasted Lawrie's sample command without inspecting it carefully and promptly changed all the G naturals to F#s.  Confused me for a minute.  Then, I fugured out I needed to enter the command thusly:  Note,Pos==b-2 Pos=#-3    (My bad)

G'day Jim,
You should explore user tools.  For example, the Global_Mod tool could easily be used to fix them.  The Global_Mod command:
Note,Pos==-2 Pos=#-3
will convert all single notes on the second line to sharp notes on the first space.  On a treble clef this would be G to F# -

That worked great except for instances when there was also a tie applied to the note.  When the note was described as Pos:b-9^  (note was G flat below middle C; had a few of those, too), it was not changed. 

I assume this is a standard search and replace function.  By my reckoning, the occurences with the tie character should also have been edited by the same command.  A standard search-and-replace in any text editor would have also affected this string. 

Was this a conscious choice by the developer?  Or determined by the scripting language syntax?  I'm a programmer, but must admit I'm not up on xml, java and php.  For scripting, I use perl.

Thanks.

Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #33
By my reckoning, the occurences with the tie character should also have been edited by the same command.  A standard search-and-replace in any text editor would have also affected this string.
Quote from: adp_GlobalMod.php help
  <opt>==<value>, meaning that <opt> is the given value, or value is present if opt is an array.
A good thing. Otherwise, Pos==1 Pos=-1 would change '-1' to '--1'.

IMO, rg_ReSpell.vbs is a better solution.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #34
Quote
A good thing. Otherwise, Pos==1 Pos=-1 would change '-1' to '--1'.

I guess, if the attribute (in this case, Pos:) is not part of the search value. 

I took a brief look at the php code, and it seems that the attributes and the values are parsed into separate array elements, so maybe that requires an exact match.  I also looked at the vbs code and couldn't make heads or tails out of it.

I do development all day long at work, and really just want to be a user of NWC in my free time, so I'll leave the development to others.

Thanks.
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #35
G'day Jim,
as Rick and others will probably tell you, I'm quite a fan of Global_Mod (thank you Andrew), but it does have it's shortcomings.

Within its limitations it really is quite useful.  I highly recommend you explore the Scripto's user tools pages as well as this sites user tools threads - lots of goodies to be found :)

If you're a member of the Newsgroup, there is even more stuff that comes up occasionally.  Usually the NG is the place if a developer wants a limited group of people for beta testing.  E.G. the fonts I developed were first tested in the NG.

http://nwc-scriptorium.org/nwc2scripts.html
https://forum.noteworthycomposer.com/?board=7.0

Newsgroup signup:
https://www.noteworthysoftware.com/newsgroup/signup.php
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #36
I also looked at the vbs code and couldn't make heads or tails out of it.
Lines 7-14 put a bunch of keystrokes into the keyboard buffer. Everything else insures that the keystrokes go to the correct window and that the window is ready to accept them.

On the half dozen staves that I have tested it on, it has caused the staff to be respelled the way I wanted.

I will be using the tool when I do  MIDI import and if it fails, I'll try to fix it. But I don't do MIDI import often so it may be some time. So far, it seems to be a viable solution to what has been a vexing problem.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #37
Lawrie.

I thought the global mod was really cool.  I got it to do what I needed.  The tie thing threw me for a minute is all.  Lookimg at the nwctxt output I figured out the "^" code pretty quickly.  I can run with it.  I got the midi file from a chant site and wanted to take it to the organ to play.  Now I just need to untangle where the inside voices cross to complete readability.  I still think NWC is the best notation application out here.

I have a co-worker who plays keyboard in a rock band and she uses Finale notepad.  She told me she can't enter notes without entering a time signature first.  I find that too restrictive since I work with free meter stuff and chant sometimes with no time signature at all.  Sometimes no bar lines either.  Took me a while to figure out how to make lines wrap.  Invisible bar lines did the trick.

I have installed the whole user tool kit and will see if anything else is there I can use.  I've browsed the user tool topics a bit.  The G flat to F sharp thing was the first problem I couldn't come up with a work around for in years of using this app.  The double whole note would be handy as a sounding notatable object, but I'll live.  I hope to hear back from Randy to see how his handbell project is working out.  I hope my transcription helped him along.  I may look into the newsgroup, too.

Thanks.  You folks are all the best.
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #38
Hey, Rick,

You posted while I was typing.  I don't do a lot of midi importing unless that is the only format available.  I've been doing some chant arrangements for organ and chant sites often notate in the ancient neume notation only and the downloadable midi file is the only easy way to get the tunes (sometimes with harmonization) into modern notation.

I understood the send keys command.  It was the rest of the code I couldn't really follow.  I took Visual Basic several years ago, but by the time I finshed the twelve weeks of 3 classes, they had already released the next version and everything was different.  Now MS has moved off to .NET and I can't keep up with it. 

Bottom line is I don't understand VBScript.  The php I kinda can read and follow.  At work, I go from MicoFocus COBOL (!), to Windows, to unix to perl to IBM Websphere to ORACLE to MSSQL and my "poor widdlle bwain" gets confused enough as it is.

Thanks for the explanation, though.  Hope folks enjoy my narratives.  I have a few more stories to tell about the neat things notation software has allowed me to do without pencil and paper.

Later.
Jim in Cleveland

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #39
I play a fair amount of renaissance music. 4/2 time signature is quite common which means you quite often get breves. I have used the text breve with two tied, hidden semibreves behind it quite successfully. The boxmarks font includes two different breve symbols. Another approach which has worked quite well is to have a single hidden semibreve plus hidden tempo mark to half the tempo of the main piece. If your breve is in the middle of a piece, you can use a tempo mpc to reduce the tempo, then increase it back to its original value.

Geoff
Geoff Walker
Middlesbrough, UK

Re: Just installed NWC 2.1 & wish list

Reply #40
Don't need a tempo MPC - just use a regular tempo mark (hidden, of course)