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Topic: Searching on the Noteworthy Website (Read 4302 times) previous topic - next topic

Searching on the Noteworthy Website



   I clearly have no understanding of how these things work.

   Why is it that a search of the NWC Website for "boxmarks", using its own internal search facility, fails to find anything, while a plain Google search for "boxmarks" turns up User Tip No: 56 -

   http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/usertips/show.php?id=56

   And how do I get to this page from the Site - and how come an internal search fails to find the page, but does turn up (a mere) three specific FAQs?  And why, if I truncate that address after the "usertips" part and look at that page, does the list it provides contain nothing from before three years ago?

   And ... following the links from the Forum on page

   https://forum.noteworthycomposer.com/?topic=6595.msg45124#msg45124

I find the PardyPack page -

   http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/uc/pardypack/

- and yet an internal Site search for "pardy" has no hits (though a search for "pardypack" does in fact turn up the same FAQ to which the Forum links)!

   I clearly have no understanding of how these things work!

   MusicJohn, 16/Oct/08

Re: Searching on the Noteworthy Website

Reply #1 –
I'm no expert, but I suspect that the answer is that the internal search engines will only search areas on the site that have been pre-defined or that there is a table of items that it searches through.

The Google search engines get their data from "crawling" from site to site, page to page, link to link picking up references and storing them away for use in their search engines.

So a Google search engine (or any of the main search engines) may not pick up some references until one of it's robots happen to have got to the page from another link - so it may be several weeks before a new item is picked up.

In a custom built search facility, the item will be there as soon as the item is added to the facility by person looking after the web site.

Applying that to the Scrioptorium for example, if you use the internal Scripto search engine to search for Boxmarks, the only hits you will get are those where Boxmarks has been mentioned in the info files that accompany submissions. You will not get a link to the helpful page to download boxmarks because the search engine has been specifically designed to search the music files, not the main HTML pages. But you will find a "Google" search engine link to the to boxmarks download on the helpful html page.
Rich.

Re: Searching on the Noteworthy Website

Reply #2 –

   Hi, Rich.

   "I'm no expert, but I suspect that the answer is that the internal search engines will only search areas on the site that have been pre-defined or that there is a table of items that it searches through."

   Hmmm.  I suspect you're right ... but why should that be?  Doesn't an "ordinary" (non-computer-wizz-kid) person expect a search to be a complete search (if you see what I mean), unless it says specifically that it isn't?  I certainly do!  It seems absurd that the internal search for "boxmarks" should fail to turn up a UserTip devoted to that very subject!  And even odder that a similar search for "swingdings" fails to turn up anything despite Lawrie being awarded a Gold Star [:-)].

   "The Google search engines get their data from "crawling" from site to site, page to page, link to link picking up references and storing them away for use in their search engines. .... But you will find a "Google" search engine link to the to boxmarks download on the helpful html page."

   Where (I do not see it)?

   I appreciate that Help facilities take second place to real programming, but at the moment they seem a very poor second.  And if Google can search the entire Site, why can't the internal search?

   MusicJohn, 16/Oct/08

Re: Searching on the Noteworthy Website

Reply #3 –
Quote from: MusicJohn –
      Where (I do not see it)?
Ahh - no - it's not there. What I saw was the link to helpful.html after finding "Swingdings" the equivalent of boxmarks.

For me, this is displayed as the 3rd Google link after searching for boxmarks.

Rich.

Re: Searching on the Noteworthy Website

Reply #4 –
G'day John,
Quote from: MusicJohn –
And if Google can search the entire Site, why can't the internal search?

IIRC, most search facilities that are actually part of a web site depend on an indexing process that usually occurs on a regular schedule.

The indexing engine will be told certain parameters, like which directory structures and files to index and, possibly, which to ignore.  Depending on which file system rights it has, it may also not even be able to see certain directory structures.  (I.E. it probably doesn't login as root...)

OTOH, a google web crawler does not concern itself with local indexes.  Instead it reports links that it finds and follows - amongst other things.

Interestingly, if you google SwingDings I get the top 2 hits - once on this site, and then on my zoundz site...  Didn't used to be the case, I was well down the list :)
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Searching on the Noteworthy Website

Reply #5 –
I'm not sure if it's already on the site, but if not, if Eric were to upload the help file Google could be used since it can target specific website or page, using a search string like this:

staff size site: noteworthysoftware.com

Re: Searching on the Noteworthy Website

Reply #6 –


   It might be better to make it

   site: noteworthysoftware.com +"staff size" -nwcforum

Putting "staff size" in quotes and with the plus sign means - in theory - that you only get hits with "staff size" and don't get hits for other "staff"s and other "size"s, while the "-nwcforum" means you don't get (as many) items from the Forum ... so you're more likely to get what Eric says and avoid what anyone else may have said.

   Though I have to say that at the moment such a Search doesn't seem all that useful!

   MusicJohn, 17/Oct/08

Re: Searching on the Noteworthy Website

Reply #7 –
Googling  "site: noteworthysoftware.com +"staff size" -nwcforum"
 elicits no matches

Tony
 

Re: Searching on the Noteworthy Website

Reply #8 –
Tony

Try it without the outside quotes. I don't think John meant you to use them - he was just quoting.
Rich.