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Special Ending Pattern

I am trying to transcribe something but use familiar endings, barlines, and flow directions.  It has

... Ending 1,3 .. Master Repeat close, Ending 2 ... "To next strain", double bar, Ending 4 .... Fine, DoubleBar close .... D.C. al Fine

where the ... represent regular measures.  My guess is Ending 2 flows to the passage after Fine, then back to the top and, following the repeat sign, Ending 4 is the "coda".

TIA. Special endings and flow changes aren't my strong suit.
Since 1998

Re: Special Ending Pattern

Reply #1 –
Hi Warren,

In this case, I don't think there will be a coda. If there were a coda the repeat instruction would be DC al Coda.
DC al Fine means go to the beginning and repeat to where Fine is marked  (before the doublebar close in your list) What you also have to remember is that unless otherwise stated, after a flow direction instruction, no repeats are performed.

So I would guess that once you get to the DC al FIne, it would go to the beginning and then play using special ending 4 (so in the special ending, you would need to have D for default as well as 4).

Without seeing the score, it's a bit difficult to guess, but that would be my interpretation.

Rich.

Re: Special Ending Pattern

Reply #2 –
Hi Warren -

Like Rich, I would like to see the score to be sure. But it looks to me as though the order of events here goes something like this (A is the section from the beginning of the piece to the point where the special endings start; B is the section between the word Fine and the end of the piece):

Quote
play A (use ending 1,3)
play A (use ending 2)
play A (use ending 1,3)
play A (use ending 4)
play B
play A (use ending 1,3)
play A (use ending 4)

Does this make sense to you when you look at the piece?

Bill

Re: Special Ending Pattern

Reply #3 –
Quote from: Warren Porter –
I am trying to transcribe something but use familiar endings, barlines, and flow directions.  It has

... Ending 1,3 .. Master Repeat close, Ending 2 ... "To next strain", double bar, Ending 4 .... Fine, DoubleBar close .... D.C. al Fine

where the ... represent regular measures.  My guess is Ending 2 flows to the passage after Fine, then back to the top and, following the repeat sign, Ending 4 is the "coda".

I see layouts like this A LOT in the music we play at church...

Flow is:
Beginning to SE1, repeat and flow into SE2, then the section AFTER SE4 and to the DC which takes you back to the top, through SE3, follow the repeat back to where it starts thence go to SE4 and finish at the Fine.  

NWC will not flow correctly on playback if you enter it this way.  The closest you can get is to make the SE1,3 into an SE1,D but be aware that the repeat in SE3 will not happen.  Then make SE4 a Coda...  It really won't work very well - you nearly have to write it out straight...  There may be other ways around it by playing with where a Coda appears, but it won't be very satisfying.

If you don't need the playback to work correctly but do need the appearance to match, then enter as written but be aware that playback will be wrong.

I've asked for better flow control, err, control, in the past but to date there seem to have been more pressing priorities...

We need to be able to override the lack of repeats after a DS or DC without resorting to a Coda to reset the repeat functionality.  

Also, in my humble opinion, DC, and DC al Fine; and DC and DC al Coda should behave differently, they do not.  Similarly, DS and DS al Fine; and DS and DS al Coda should also behave differently, again, they do not.  A DC should be just that.  A DS should be just that.  To Coda and Fine directives should be ignored unless they are referred to by the DS or DC explicitly.

Another useful flow control object would be a Codetta and appropriate related directives, though this is considerably less of a problem.

These flow issues cause me no end of trouble when I'm transcribing things...
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Special Ending Pattern

Reply #4 –
Using William's format, I think this is the flow of the piece:
Quote
play A use 1,3
play A use 2
play B
play A use 1,3     <-- missing this rep in following paragraph
play A use 4

It looks like what I'll have to do is kill the 3rd ending, move the 4th ending to the end of the piece and replace 4th ending with Coda.  The original DC al Fine is now DC al Coda and a new "To Coda" is just to the left of the master rep closed.  Since the DC won't cause repeats the 1st ending will in effect be the 3rd ending as well.  Still don't see a way to include the 3rd ending w/o writing out the whole piece though.

Fortunately I won't be using this score while someone else is using the original.  This is awkward enough.

Since this is copyrighted, I'll only share it via PM or email.
Since 1998

Re: Special Ending Pattern

Reply #5 –
Quote from: Warren Porter –
I'll only share it via PM or email.
I've yet to find any flow that cannot be done in NWC without reordering provided that no section is repeated more than 8 times. If you send the file, I'll look at it.
possible solution sent ...
Registered user since 1996
 

Re: Special Ending Pattern

Reply #7 –
Neat workaround Rick.  But I'd still prefer to have flow control work properly.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.