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Topic: Slur Bugs (Read 12065 times) previous topic - next topic

Slur Bugs

The slurs in the attachment should not cross the red marks. The start of a slur above a voice should not be affected by a lower voice.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #1 –
I concur.  Whilst there has been significant improvement in slurs over V1.75 there is still a ways to go.

I still reckon we could use control over start and end points as well as curvature - those "handles" I mentioned in another post.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.
 

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #2 –
I agree with both posts.

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #3 –
Rick and Lawrie are both right, as usual. Slurs remain the area in NWC that need the most work in order to get results that look like professionally engraved music.

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #4 –
Quote from: Lawrie Pardy –
there has been significant improvement in slurs over V1.75 there is still a ways to go.
Agreed, but it is not going anywhere. Here is the progress since Public Preview 1d (Nov 2004):
  • Public Preview 1s - Fix for single note slurs not being visible. Improve slur drawing into special endings and system breaks
  • Beta 2.06 - Critical fix for slur/lyric/grace-note mechanism when opening files created in version 1
  • Beta 2.23 - Fix slur conversion issues when loading files created with NWC1

By putting slurs on their own staff, I can get them in the correct place vertically to within 1 vertical space. This is far from ideal, but useable. For now, I would just like to be able to get slurs to start and end horizontally somewhere near the correct place. I can only clip them so much (with digital white-out) before they stop looking like slurs.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #5 –
I prefer the look of the slurs in version 1, but I want them not to be parallel to the staff, and I want them to be able to be placed on "the wrong side" of the note when need, and some "handles" would be lovely also.

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #6 –
Quote
For now, I would just like to be able to get slurs to start and end horizontally somewhere near the correct place.

Would fiddling with extra shorter notes in a layered staff help?  Sort of like this? (The half and the eighths are intended to slur together - sorry for the inelegance and likely errors.  I just patched this together quickly because I need to leave for band in a few minutes.)

Top staff
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|Note|Dur:4th|Pos:-3
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:-1
|Note|Dur:8th|Pos:-2|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam=First
|Note|Dur:8th|Pos:-3|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam=End
|Bar
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End

Second, layered staff
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|Note|Dur:4th|Pos:-3
|Note|Dur:8th|Pos:-1z|Opts:StemLength=0
|Note|Dur:8th,Slur|Pos:-1z|Opts:StemLength=0
|Note|Dur:8th,Slur|Pos:-1z|Opts:StemLength=0
|Note|Dur:8th,Slur|Pos:-1z|Opts:StemLength=0
|Note|Dur:16th,Slur|Pos:-2z|Opts:StemLength=0
|Note|Dur:16th|Pos:-2z|Opts:StemLength=0
|Note|Dur:8th|Pos:-3z|Opts:StemLength=0
|Bar
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #7 –
Quote from: David Palmquist –
Would fiddling with extra shorter notes in a layered staff help?  Sort of like this?
No. Certainly not like that. I would just use:
Quote
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|Note|Dur:4th|Pos:-3
|Note|Dur:Half,Slur|Pos:-1
|Note|Dur:8th,Slur|Pos:-2|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam=First
|Note|Dur:8th|Pos:-3|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam=End
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End
Sometimes, NWC2 gets it right.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #8 –
I gather your goal, then, is to have the slur arc begin under the centre of the first slurred note, and to end under the centre of the last note?



Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #9 –
My immediate goal is to get slurs that start on stems to start at the stem (in the X direction).
It seems to me that it is never correct to start such slurs to the left of the stem.

I can clip 2 or 3 tenths of a notewidth off the left side of the slur and still make the printout acceptable.
Clipping 6 or 7 tenths of a notewidth off the left side of the slur is unacceptable for short slurs.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #10 –
NWC2 Beta 2.25 includes low level improvements to this area of the slurs. It will be available shortly.

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #12 –
Sorry about putting that in the wrong place and many thanks for this fix.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #13 –
Quote from: Beta 2.26
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|TimeSig|Signature:3/2
|Note|Dur:Half,Slur|Pos:3|Opts:Stem=Down,Slur=Upward
|RestChord|Dur:Whole|Opts:Stem=Down|Dur2:Whole|Pos2:0
|Bar
|Note|Dur:Half,Slur|Pos:-4|Opts:Stem=Up,Slur=Upward
|RestChord|Dur:Whole|Opts:Stem=Down|Dur2:Whole|Pos2:0
|Bar
|Note|Dur:Half,Slur|Pos:-4|Opts:Stem=Up,Slur=Upward
|Note|Dur:Whole|Pos:0|Opts:Stem=Up
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End
Slur end in measures 2 and 3 is wrong. End should be at notehead center, not notehead right.

It suprises me that measure 1 is correct. The end of a slur to a notehead should always be to the notehead center. How the slur starts should be irrelevant. Perhaps the program is too smart for its own good :)
Registered user since 1996

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #14 –
G'day Eric,
nice to see some improvements.  To add to Rick's observations:

Code: [Select · Download]
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|TimeSig|Signature:3/2
|RestChord|Dur:Whole,Slur|Opts:Stem=Down,Slur=Upward,ArticulationsOnStem|Dur2:Whole,Slur|Pos2:0
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:3
|Bar
|RestChord|Dur:Whole,Slur|Opts:Stem=Down,ArticulationsOnStem|Dur2:Whole,Slur|Pos2:0
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:3
|Bar
|Note|Dur:Whole,Slur|Pos:0
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:3
|Bar
|Note|Dur:Whole,Slur|Pos:0|Opts:Slur=Downward
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:3
|Bar
|Note|Dur:Whole,Slur|Pos:0
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:-3
|Bar
|Note|Dur:Whole,Slur|Pos:0|Opts:Slur=Downward
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:-3
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End

Slur starts in bars 2 and 4 are also in the wrong place.  They seem to be positioning as if there were a stem, which shouldn't have any affect anyhow as the slur should start at notehead centre.  Is this being caused by the slur ending position? Slur direction should not affect horizontal positioning.  Also, end points should be independent of each other in that how a slur starts OR finishes should not affect the other end as far as horizontal location is concerned.

Note that bars 5 and 6 are fine.

A question: In the case of bar 5, I have seen, in the past, slurs seek the notehead AND in similar constructs (stem up note at the end of the slur) seek the stem.  What defines where the slur will terminate?

Thanks mate.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #15 –
Quote from: Lawrie Pardy –
Slur starts in bars 2 and 4 are also in the wrong place.
I don't see a problem with #2 unless you set the slur direction to upward.

The problem seems to be one of not realizing that whole notes don't have stems.

All notes have a stem direction and length. These may be implied or explicit.
All notes except those with a base duration of Whole or Breve have a stem.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #16 –
G'day Rick,
Quote from: Rick G. –
I don't see a problem with #2 unless you set the slur direction to upward.

The problem seems to be one of not realizing that whole notes don't have stems.

All notes have a stem direction and length. These may be implied or explicit.
All notes except those with a base duration of Whole or Breve have a stem.

Umm, just to make sure - I was referring to my bars 2 and 4...  The slur starts at the left of the note - what would be the end of the stem if the note had one...

Setting slur direction upwards is the same as (my) bar 1 which is fine.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #17 –
Quote from: Beta 2.26
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|Text|Text:"\|"|Font:PageText|Pos:-5|Justify:Center|Placement:AtNextNote|Color:1
|RestChord|Dur:Whole,Slur|Opts:Stem=Down,ArticulationsOnStem|Dur2:Whole,Slur|Pos2:0
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:3
|Bar
|Text|Text:"\|"|Font:PageText|Pos:-7|Justify:Center|Placement:AtNextNote|Color:1
|RestChord|Dur:Half,Slur|Opts:Stem=Down,ArticulationsOnStem|Dur2:Whole,Slur|Pos2:0
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:3
|Bar
|Text|Text:"\|"|Font:PageText|Pos:-7|Justify:Center|Placement:AtNextNote|Color:1
|RestChord|Dur:4th,Slur|Opts:Stem=Down,ArticulationsOnStem|Dur2:Whole,Slur|Pos2:0
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:3
|Bar
|Text|Text:"\|"|Font:PageText|Pos:-10|Justify:Center|Placement:AtNextNote|Color:1
|RestChord|Dur:32nd,Slur|Opts:Stem=Down,ArticulationsOnStem|Dur2:Whole,Slur|Pos2:0
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:3
|Bar
|Text|Text:"\|"|Font:PageText|Pos:-12|Justify:Center|Placement:AtNextNote|Color:1
|RestChord|Dur:64th,Slur|Opts:Stem=Down,ArticulationsOnStem|Dur2:Whole,Slur|Pos2:0
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:3
|Bar
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End
Yes I was refering to your #2. It is off-center, but only by a tiny amount. It certainly does not start 'at the left of the note'.
This will happen on all rests except 4th and 8th. 4th and 8th rests are narrower than a standard notehead. All others are wider. As I said above, I can live with this small decrepancy. The bug in your #4 and my #2 and #3 need to be addressed.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Slur Bugs

Reply #18 –
G'day Rick,
Quote from: Rick G. –
Yes I was refering to your #2. It is off-center, but only by a tiny amount. It certainly does not start 'at the left of the note'.
This will happen on all rests except 4th and 8th. 4th and 8th rests are narrower than a standard notehead. All others are wider. As I said above, I can live with this small decrepancy. The bug in your #4 and my #2 and #3 need to be addressed.

Hmm, seems I'm the victim of an optical delusion ;) - thanks for correcting me mate.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.