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Topic: Midi Playback wierdness (Read 43489 times) previous topic - next topic

Midi Playback wierdness

NW has suddenly stopped playing back the scores.
I checked Tools/Options/Midi and I have three options showing: Microsoft Midi Mapper, Turtle Beach USB Midi 1x1, and Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth.
I can select either MM or Synth, but selecting them both (with or without TB) gives an error message: "The following devices failed..." and names whichever one (between the Midi Mapper and the SW Synth) that happened to be put on the list last.

I have experimented leaving each one off, leaving all off, different combinations of only 2 or 1, ... nothing will restore the sound for playback--except through my keyboard (TB USB Midi 1x1).

I can either select the MM or the Synth, but not both, and neither will play back through my system speakers.

I tested the playback with windows media player (11), which I just updated, and it plays midi and mp3 playback just fine, as does SynthFont, but Noteworthy no longer plays my scores back through my speakers or earphones.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #1 –
Pausing a MIDI in WMP 11, sets MIDI volume to zero. Closing WMP with it paused, leaves the volume at zero. More discussion here.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #2 –
Rick, this tip is a golden one.
I have helped quite number of people with "silent Noteworthy" already, telling them to stard sndvol32 and unchecking the mute box of the FM Synthesizer. Works without fail. But I have recently upgraded my response to include the reason. And helped someone only two days ago, doing just that.
So - thanks!
Rob.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #3 –
Quote from: RobdenHeijer –
... unchecking the mute box of the FM Synthesizer ...
Not sure what you mean by "the mute box of the FM Synthesizer".

Windows does not enable the mute checkbox for MIDI volume for every soundcard. It greys it out with my old SBAWE32. WMP just drops MIDI vol to zero instead.
Registered user since 1996

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #4 –
Quote from: Rick G. –
Pausing a MIDI in WMP 11, sets MIDI volume to zero. Closing WMP with it paused, leaves the volume at zero.

Thanks for the information. This was the step that I had not discovered.

I have updated our play back FAQ entry for play back volume, and it appears on our home page.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #5 –
SW Synth, I should have said. I'll try to double-check next time.
Rob.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #6 –
I've also got something strange but it isn't silence. I just got a new computer and the voice oohs play like some rinky-dink zylophone. Anyone know why? I had a Soundblaster soundcard on the old computer. This one's sound care -- can it be that bad or am I missing something? Oh. I have Vista. and that's beginning to look like a mistake. Thanks. Dan

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #7 –
G'day Dan,
The quality of the sound you hear is directly related to the MIDI synth you are using.

There are several possibilities:
  • Your new sound card has a hardware synth that just isn't much good
  • Your new sound card has no hardware synth and the software synth you were supplied with isn't much good
  • The Vista softsynth isn't much good
  • Your new sound card uses sound fonts and the one currently selected isn't much good

I am yet to look at Vista - will have to soon as we will be needing to support it sooner or later...  (I have an IT business)

That said, I don't know what M$ are using as a softsynth in this version.  XP had a reasonable softsynth that used Roland samples.  Note that I said reasonable, not good...  I have heard that due to licencing compliance issues there had been changes to Vista (from XP) relating to sound reproduction.  Perhaps this is one, I don't know.

Maybe you could list for us the MIDI synths available to you in NWC...  Go to:
  • Tools
  • Options
  • MIDI Tab
  • Available Play Devices

This will gives us some clues that may enable a bit better advice to emerge...
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #8 –
I could really use some help. I recently got a new computer and I can't get the sound to work on the noteworthy program. I read all the help on it and this discussion. I also ran the programs and have looked at all the sound settings I can. The SW synth this is not muted and is at full blast. In fact nothing is muted on anything I ran and found. I don't know what media player version I have and I am using windows xp. One big reason I got the new computer was so I could use noteworthy! I would really appreciate the help!
Keavie

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #9 –
Here are things to try:

  • Make sure that you are using the sample files that come with NWC when testing sound.
  • Make sure that you are using only one device from Tools, Options, Midi.
  • Check your system's volume mixer. There are usually two separate volume sliders: one for the system, and one for the MIDI synthesizer. Both can have a large impact on play back volume.

See also:

FAQ - No sound or volume during play back
http://ntworthy.com/composer/faq/65.htm

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #10 –
Thanks so much for replying, I tried everything you suggested, and I did choose the microsoft GS wavetable etc in the options tab. The Sw synth thing and all my other volumes are not muted. It still doesn't work. I just don't know what to do.
Keavie

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #11 –
Usually, volume problems are not caused by the device being muted. Rather, it is caused by the volume slider being turned all the way down. Media Player will routinely do this.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #12 –
One step at the time, then.
Do you get any sound at all? Does Windows play start and shutdown sounds? When you receive e-mail, does it say "pling"? Can you test the volume in any way?
If so, can you play Midi files?

Once you can play and hear Midi files, it's time to go back to the Noteworthy-problem, if at that time this problem still persists. Go back to the original settings (Microsoft GS wavetable or not?) and start sndvol32.exe once again. Check main volume and sw synth, as before,
cheers,
Rob.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #13 –
1. Do you get any sound at all?
      Yes I can play music, mp3s and such normally and I use skype to talk to friends which works fine.

2.Does Windows play start and shutdown sounds?
      No it doesn't, however I hear the noise when I get an error and things like that.

3.When you receive e-mail, does it say "pling"?
      I have gmail which doesn't have sounds to it.

4.Can you test the volume in any way?
      Sound works on skype, and yahoo games, mp3s..

5. If so, can you play Midi files?
     I downloaded a midi to try it out. It opened with Nero Showtime 2 and I couldnt hear it so I tried it in Windows Media player and had the same no sound result. I looked in the settings for windows media player but I didnt see anything that looked helpful.

Thanks for replying so quickly!
Keavie

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #14 –
I'm not sure what operating system you have, but if it's WindowsXP, there should be a little speaker-shaped icon in the bottom right corner of your screen.  Open it, and make sure you aren't set to "mute."

If you select Open Volume Control with that icon, you'll see Play Control, which should have a midi option.  That too might be muted.


Also go through the Start menu to Settings, to Control Panel and select Sounds and Audio Devices.   A grey popup window should open up.  On the Volume tab, check to see if anything is muted.  In the Audio tab, see what shows in the Midi Playback Device window.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #15 –
Thankyou very much but I have been through every tab and opened the sound windows and nothing is muted.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #16 –
G'day keavie,
This:
Quote from: keavie –
5. If so, can you play Midi files?
     I downloaded a midi to try it out. It opened with Nero Showtime 2 and I couldnt hear it so I tried it in Windows Media player and had the same no sound result. I looked in the settings for windows media player but I didnt see anything that looked helpful.

points the finger squarely at your MIDI subsystem.

Now, I know you've checked, and probably re-checked and re-checked, but I'm gonna ask you to do it again - 'tis amazing how a little thing can sometimes escape us...

  • First, go to control panel and select "Sounds Speech and Audio Devices"
  • now you want "Sounds and Audio Devices", then the "Audio (Tab)"
  • and at last the "MIDI music playback" | "Default device:" - What is it? - This device is what Media Player etc will use for MIDI playback.
  • By default this will be the "Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth" - you can change it if you want but for testing this is a good choice.
  • Open your volume control (Start|Run|sndvol32) OR double click the speaker icon in the system tray (near the clock)
  • Make sure that in |Options|Properties| you have "Adjust volume for" Playback selected and a tick in at least "Play Control" and "MIDI Synth"
  • Also confirm the "Mixer device:" in case you have 2 sound cards...
  • "OK" back to the "Play Control" window and check the Mute box and Volume sliders for Play Control and MIDI Synth.  They SHOULD NOT be muted and the Volume sliders should NOT be at or near the bottom of the scale - about half is probably good for testing...  Maybe FULL  :)
  • With the "Play Control" still open, try playing a MIDI with, say, media player - watch what it does to the MIDI Synth controls - depending on version it will probably move the volume slider all the way down when it's finished.
  • Another very good MIDI player is "van Bascos karaoke player" - I highly recommend it for ANY musician playing back MIDI.  The channel and piano keyboard displays are quite informative.  If you don't mind I'd recommend installing this software and testing with it too.  It also has the virtue of allowing you to select other MIDI synths than the default MIDI mapper assigned one.
  • If the above is all good, then NWC should playback quite happily, if not, then it can't 'cos the MIDI has to be right.

Sorry to be long winded, I hope something "clicks" for you and you see where the problem is.

One question did just occur to me... What sound card do you have?  Hmm, and another... What MIDI synths are available to you?

Please let me know the results and I'll consider the next step - or maybe one of the others will have an epiphany ;)
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #17 –
Thanks for replying! I am currently on vacation, but I will check it out first thing when I get back.
Keavie

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #18 –
OK! so I went through the list of things you mentioned lawrie and Checked every box possible  I can under the sounds and audio devices so that I can view all of their settings. I SWEAR nothing is muted and all of it is   at full blast, espically the SW Synth. I also ran media player with a midi, and it did change the status of the Sw Synth setting. It played the  midi file in Media player, but it didn't have any sound and yes I tried several midis to know that it wasnt them. I did select the only option I have which is the Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth. ok let me state again I ran the sndvol32 and looked everything over and nothing is muted. I also clicked on the Sounds and audio devices and made sure every setting is viewable under the sndvol32. Nothing is muted!. Ok here are the stats on my computer.
No sound card persay, just the what the motherboard itself has.
I only have the GS Wavetable SW Synth option.
I also have Realtek HD Audio Manager as the sound icon thing in the taskbar and yes everything is unmuted and high.
I do have windows XP.

To Dave:  When I ran audio devices and settings and under the volume tab it just says Realtek HD Audio output, then device volume which is on high and not muted, and then the speaker settings which are also unmuted and on high. Under the audio tab I have the only option checked which is Microsoft GS wavetable sw synth and when I click on volume for it it says it is unmuted and all the way up.

Thanks for your time. But seriously the sw synth and the midi volume and all the other volumes are not muted. :)

Keavie

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #19 –
G'day keavie,
thanks for checking those things again, I know you must be gettin' pretty frustrated by now...

OK, given that you can hear wav's etc. and based on your other results I'm beginning to think that the problem must be something intercepting the MIDI stream...

Do you have anything like MIDIYoke and MIDIOX?

MIDIYoke is a "virtual MIDI cable" tool that allows you to connect MIDI outputs and inputs to each other.

E.G. you could use a MIDIYoke port to output NWC to and cross connect to another port for output.  Then, using MIDIOX and selecting the MIDIYoke port defined as your output for the MIDIOX input you could view the MIDI data stream and make sure it exists!

MIDIOX can also direct your MIDI data stream to an output device, like your MS Softsynth so you can still hear it.

I understand that this may seem a little complex so I won't be offended if you don't want to try this.

Another thought...  Are you aware of anything that may be installed that could be interrupting the MIDI data?
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #20 –
As I understand it:

  • your system's lone MIDI device is the Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth
  • when you play MIDI files with Microsoft's Media Player, you can see the system mixer's SW Synth volume slider move when changing volume in the Media Player
  • you do not hear anything when using Microsoft's Media Player with MIDI files
  • you can hear other things played through Microsoft's Media Player, such as system sounds, mp3 files, and videos

If all of these points are accurate, then under these circumstances, perhaps your Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth is broken. Since this is a software only virtual device, this generally would indicate a configuration issue on your system. I would start by checking the Windows system logs, which you can see by visiting the Administrative Tools in the Control Panel. System Restore might be able to help you if this problem started recently.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #22 –
The GS wavetable synth might be broken but I hope not, I just got the computer and have had it less than a month. It was built as a gaming computer, but it should still work with music lol. ugh. Ok Lawrie, I downloaded the Midiox, and I read what you said to do, but wow, I'm really not sure how to do that. I really don't know if something is interupting the midi, I can't recall anything I have that would do it. Admin: There didn't seem to be any problems indicated in the logs.

Keavie.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #23 –
Did you also get MIDIYoke?  To do what I've suggested you'll need both.

However, what Noteworthyonline says is true - it is very likely a broken MS softsynth...

One thing I am curious about - if this is a games machine, how come such a cruddy audio subsystem?  I mean the SoundMax isn't exactly known for it's wonderful signal to noise ratio or anything.  If your games use embedded wav or mp3 then that's one thing, but if they use MIDI surely you'd want something better than the MS softsynth and a SoundMax.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #24 –
Ok I will also download the other. I will be playing World of Warcraft with it. The other game I play is text based so we don;t actually have sounds :)
Keavie

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #25 –
Ok I installed midi ox and midiyoke and Ive read your description of what to do a few times but would you mind explaining it again please?
Keavie.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #26 –
G'day Keavie,
OK, step by step...

  • Open MIDI-OX
  • Select Options|MIDI Devices and make sure that "Automatically attach Inputs to Outputs during selection" is ticked
  • In MIDI Outputs (Bottom left) click "Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth" (It will appear in the "Port Mapping" area)
  • In MIDI Inputs (Top left) click "MIDI Yoke NT: 1" (It will appear in the "Port Map Objects" area)
  • Click OK
  • You should see a small window called "MIDI Port activity" showing - if not, then click |View|Port Status| and it will appear.
  • Leave MIDI-OX running and open NWC
  • Click |Tools|Options|MIDI (tab)
  • Remove all devices in "Devices used by play back"
  • In "Available play devices" double click "MIDI Yoke NT: 1" - it will appear in "Devices used by play back" and should be the only one there.
  • Open or create an NWC file and start it playing
  • Change to MIDI-OX and observe the "MIDI Port Activity" window
  • You should see activity in both input and areas of the window.

Please let me know what you find.

After you've finished this test you should restore NWC to using ONLY "Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth" in "Devices used by play back"

BTW, did you see the PM (personal message) I sent you?
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #27 –
Ok thanks, Yes the nwc seemed to register in the midi port activities input and output.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #28 –
G'day Keavie,
but still no sound?  Then I think that as Noteworthynline suggested, you have a problem with your synth.

A "repair install" might resolve it, however it would be worthwhile to consider this first:

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/193255

m$ refer to "gm16.dls", however on my XP system this file does not exist.  Instead it is called "gm.dls".  The article also refers to '98 instead of XP and this is probably the reason for the name difference.

I recommend you check your "C:\Windows\system32\drivers" folder for the existence of "gm.dls".  If it's not there then extract a copy from your XP CD as discussed in the articel cross reference and place it there.

You might also look for "wdmaud.sys" (in "drivers") and "wdmaud.drv" (in "system32") and restore them if they're missing - NB I believe these files have been updated in SP2 for XP so if your XP CD is not SP2 then you should re-apply SP2 (without overwriting newer files) after restoring these files - assuming you needed to that is...

Hopefully this will get you working.

I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #29 –
THANKYOU!!!!!!!!!! THANKYOU!!!!!! THANKYOU!!!!!! I aparently didn't even have that Gm16.dls file at all! Now I do and it works! thankyou soo much for your time and effort!!!
Keavie

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #30 –
G'day Keavie - glad you got it working.

Just one question - I thought you were running XP - the file should have been "gm.dls", not "gm16.dls"...?

Anyhow, it's working - that's good!
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #31 –
Yes I believe it was the gm.dls. I just got them confused :)
Keavie

Re: Midi Playback wierdness

Reply #32 –
Lawrie, as so often before, you've saved the day once again!  Good on you, mate!