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Topic: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software (Read 7683 times) previous topic - next topic

Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Say is there a way to convert Noteworthy files to Finale and vice-versa? I enjoy working with Noteworthy but there are applications I need for my music that are not there e.g. Tuplets and so on.
Also while at it, how can I find the page to submit my wish list?
 

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #3 –
The biggest problem with format conversion is that from time to time, formats change. It becomes a hassle keeping up with the changes. Plus, some things cannot be converted, because they are proprietary.

Let me give you an example. It's outside the scope of NWC, but shows the problem: Modern browsers can use a DOCTYPE statement to determine how to display a web page. The DOCTYPE statement is supposed to be at the top. If it's not there, the browser may assume that the page is coded according to older methods, and react accordingly.

But the very latest pages have an XML statement preceding the DOCTYPE. If the browser is smart enough, it understands this. If not, it interprets the page as missing a DOCTYPE, and reacts as if the page is antique rather than modern.

That's with the heavy players (Microsoft and Netscape) who actually participate in a consortium (W3C).

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #4 –
That's with the heavy players [Microsoft and Netscape] who actually participate in a consortium [W3C].

Unfortunately, one of those players will only play if it's with their ball. In their ballpark. By their rules. :-(

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #5 –
Thanks to you guys for your comments, but I must tell Robert A. that I am really not familiar with those terms he used. As you can see, I am at ABC as far as this is concerned, but I hope to do some catching up,perhaps you can still help? It is sure good to know that there is a way to do this.Thanks once again.

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #6 –
Don't worry if you didn't catch my terms. Three months ago, I didn't know them, either! Fred's comment is a simpler explanation.

In the music world, the gorilla is Coda's Finale. It is unlikely that Coda will go to the effort to import other software formats. But anyone wanting to import the Finale format may have to play a catch-up game every time the format changes - and that's even if their format can be used by others in the first place (not necessarily true).

My comment about browsers was that there are supposed to be "standards." But the various browsers, intentionally or accidentally, are non-standard.

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #7 –
Thanks Robert, I have visited Fred.His information is very helpful. You are right about Finale, I like NWC for it's ease.

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #8 –
>In the music world, the gorilla is Coda's Finale.

In the US.  Sibelius is purportedly the proggy of choice in Europe.

>But anyone wanting to import the Finale format may have to play a catch-up game every time the format changes - and that's even if their format can be used by others in the first place (not necessarily true).

True, but someone's doing this already.  Check out http://www.recordare.com/xml.html .  Recordare's got a Finale plugin that converts MusicXML, supposedly in both directions (I don't have Finale, so I haven't tried it), called Dolet.  They've also got a unidirectional Dolet for Sibelius which converts from .sib to MusicXML, and it does work, at least partially.  It's slow, though, and still in beta.  (Incidentally, the file that I tested it on I tested by running it through a converter [xml2ly at http://www.nongnu.org/xml2ly/] to Lilypond [http://lilypond.org/stable/], which, although it wasn't quite set on the page I wanted it, was nevertheless beautifully typeset and, so far as I could tell, exactly right.)

In other news, in theory (read: I haven't touched this for a month) I'm working on developing a NWC to MusicXML (and vice-versa) converter.  More news when that actually happens, probably over the summer.

>Unfortunately, one of those players will only play if it's with their ball. In their ballpark. By their rules. :-(

So quit going to the games ;-)

>Modern browsers can use a DOCTYPE statement to determine how to display a web page.

Presumably browser support could be added for MusicXML as well, although that's not it's primary focus.  A plugin, or perhaps built-in support could work.

>My comment about browsers was that there are supposed to be "standards." But the various browsers, intentionally or accidentally, are non-standard.

Not to be, um, contrary (which, I know, is unlike me), but isn't Mozilla supposed to be 100% standard?  Anyway, for those of you looking for an alternative browser, do look at Mozilla.  Netscape's latest browsers are based on the code from this project.  http://www.mozilla.org .

Geoff

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #9 –
Bweh, sorry about those grammatical errors.

Geoff

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #10 –
Sure, Mozilla is supposed to be 100% standard. And MS Office is supposed to be the solution to all your business needs.

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #11 –
Mozilla is (according to their own claim) the "most" standards-compliant browser out there. But note that they're careful not to claim 100% compliance. Nor do they claim to be the "best". They're only trying - as they put it - to design a browser that doesn't suck.

Part of the problem is due to ambiguity in the W3C standards. This is especially problematical when there is a conflict (e.g. poorly written web-pages in which the html specifies one thing, and the css another); which one takes precedence?

Another is that there are still a great many non-compliant web-pages out there. I dare say that the majority of web pages on the 'net are not W3C compliant. Mozilla tries to get around this at least partially by having two modes of operation: "complaint" mode, and "quirks" mode. If if finds a web page that appears to be written with older versions of Netscape (or IE, IIRC) in mind, it goes into quirks mode in an attempt to display it as intended.

In all fairness, part of the blame for the present standards problem can be laid at Netscape's door; it's not quite entirely Microsoft's fault. During the "browser wars" Netscape came up with its own quirks, in an attempt to out-quirk Microquirk. Their action is perhaps understandable, as they were very much under attack, but in hindsight it might have served them better to defend the moral high ground and insist on standards evangelism.

All that being said, the biggest hope we have for a standard internet at some time in the distant future is Mozilla, and similar Open Source projects (such as OpenOffice.org, since Microcrock Office was mentioned in this connection also).

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #12 –
... I recently upgraded my web pages to XHTML1.0 Strict, or XHTML1.1 if possible. Fully validated, with CSS fully validated.

Nevertheless, Some looked different in Netscape 7 than they did in IE 6. Many look even odder in IE5 (someone else's computer). Some of the code had to be hacked to comply with Opera. I'm not even going to bother hacking code for IE5. For some of my pages, if the user has netscape 4.x, the page won't display (re-direct to a simplified page).

As Fred noted, a large part of this is due to ambiguity in the standards. or to a "standard" method that differs from "the way everyone has been doing it for the last 5 years."

What has this to do with NWC? Answer: From time to time, there are requests for standardized (inter-program) file formats, etc., cross-platform functionality, etc. Good grief!

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #13 –
>Sure, Mozilla is supposed to be 100% standard. And MS Office is supposed to be the solution to all your business needs.

Only if my business-needs are kissing Billy's Boots.  And yeah, Fred's right... the "most standards compliant."  My bad.

:-D

>... I recently upgraded my web pages to XHTML1.0 Strict, or XHTML1.1 if possible. Fully validated, with CSS fully validated.

Me too.  And yeah, it does look different in different browsers ('course, the ones you noted besides netscape don't use the "most standards compliant" rendering engine...).

In further news, I was finally able to get the NWC file to uncompress, so now it's just a matter of reading it, parsing it and writing out to MusicXML.  Easy ;-)  Oh, and then translating it to C so that I can make an executable out of it, um, and so (presumably) the NWC folks could include it in their program and have a whole new set of bugs to worry about.  :-)

Geoff

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #14 –
...my goodness! I didn't think anyone would get that far.

Re: Converting Noteworthy files to Another software

Reply #15 –
Well, it shouldn't have been so hard... refer to https://forum.noteworthycomposer.com/?topic=3085.msg18856#msg18856 . But I just couldn't get it to work...  I tried C, C++, PHP (I don't know any java...).  Then I finally found a part in another bit of code from someone else that removed 1 byte (1 lousy byte)... so I tried it and it decompressed like a champ.

The rest is just using my notes to classify each note and stuff as it comes along, and stick it into arrays, then translate to MusicXML.

Geoff