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Topic: Writing for Drums and Percussion (Read 9400 times) previous topic - next topic

Writing for Drums and Percussion

Hi fellow NWC users,

I would like to compose songs in midi and then provide copies to my band members so they may learn their parts. However writing for Drums/Percussion has baffled me.

When it comes to notating drums, I noticed that each "beat" or sound has a definite pitch. This "selected" pitch is then written as a note on the staff. However everyone tunes drums differently and I was wondering if there was a "standard tuning" for drums when it comes to composing or do I simply write the drum parts the way I would like them to be played?

In other words, when I compose a drum part and present the score to my drummer, do I actually say, "Besides playing the rhythm correctly, I would like you to concentrate on playing/sounding the exact notes as written, for example please play this C note followed by an A note etc. etc."

I get the feeling the drummer will respond by saying something like, "Isn't it good enough that I'm simply playing the rhythm correctly?"

Thank you
Walter Lepore

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #1 –
I assume you have already looked at drumref.nwc in your samples folder.  Also, take a look at the top "staff" in CAVERNS.

If you would like only one instrument per staff, you can (with F2) set the staff to have only one line and the only notes would be on that line.  By adjusting the staff transposition attribute you can have the sound each instrument produces only on the line for that staff.  HTH
Since 1998

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #2 –
MIDI representation and printed notation for drum parts are not related.
What has to be written on a staff to produce the correct SOUND combination of bass drum, snare, toms and cymbals bears no relationship to the placement of the notes on the printed part.

(Download the Command Summary from the Scriptorium for some documentation on percussion parts).
http://nwc-scriptorium.org/

Kit drum parts are usually written on a Percussion or Bass Clef.
(Using Bass clef notation).
Bass (kick) drum in the A space near the bottom of the stave.
Snare in the E space above.
High-hat Cymbals in the G space above that.
Ride Cymbal at B above the staff.
Crash Cymbal similar but circled.
Toms can be placed anywhere from F down to B in the staff as long as a notation (Toms) is placed above the staff.
Usually I would write Toms at D,C,B (between snare and bass drums).
There are variations to this but this is the general layout.
For example I have seen the foot pedal of the high-hat placed at F below the staff in text books but in 50 years I have never seen a commercial drum part written that way.

Hope that helps.

Barry Graham
Top Brass Events Band
Melbourne, Australia

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #3 –
Hi Barry

Is your Drumkit utility compatible with windows 2000?

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #4 –
Hi Barry

Please be patient as I am learning all the in's and out's of composition at this time and have many questions. I've been studying music theory and composition for quite some time and have finally taken the "leap" and purchased NWC.

I did not know that MIDI representation and printed notation for drum parts are not related.

In other words, when I compose drum parts for midi, the final drum staff will make no sense to a drummer? If so I would then have to prepare "another" score specifically for the drummer so he/she can can make sense of it?

Therefore there are two composing formats for drum parts. 1) I first need to create the score so I can hear what the drum part will sound like. This is known as Midi Representation or MIDI notation?

and ........

2) I create another score specifically designed for drummers to read from and this will be prepared in aprintable notation format?

Thanks
Walter Lepore

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #5 –
You can achieve both at the same time by layering lots of staffs, all on MIDI channel 16.

Notate the instruments as you would like to see them, one per staff, and then transpose each staff to the correct MIDI pitch. Judicious use of clef (invisible unless Bass) with octave shift up or down will reduce the transposition ranges.

Once you have them sounding right, layer the whole lot into one staff.

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #6 –
Just two notes on Peter's reply:

1) Most sound cards / synths will have the percussion channel on channel 10, not 16. Though, there are exceptions; consult the manual for your synth if in doubt.

2) An alternate approach to lots of layered staves is to just have two pairs of layered staves, one visible but muted (notation) and one hidden but sounding (midi). An example is My Best Friend.

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #7 –
Why would one need to have hidden staves?

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #8 –
Fred of course is quite correct about the channel - I plead old age and incipient dementia.

Walter, if you go Fred's route (and inherently I've never been a fan of duplicated staves since it's twice the work ;-( ) then you have one staff for show and one staff for business.

Chacûn a son goût I suppose.

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #9 –
Actually, if the truth be known, I only actually write one staff (or pair of staves, since I find it easier to keep the drums and cymbals separate). I then export those two staves to a Type 0 midi, and use Barry's "Drumkit" utility to generate the visual staff; I then simply import the result midi, copy the resulting staff, and paste it into my composition. ;-)

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #10 –
Walter,

I don't know whether the Drumkit conversion runs under Win2000.
But I have a day or two spare now I've retired and I expect to produce a Windows version of Drumkit that is a bit more user friendly if you can wait a week.
------------
Barry Graham
Top Brass Events Band
Melbourne, Australia

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #11 –
There is a generally recognised format for scoring out percussion parts, but sadly, Noteworthy appears reluctant to embrace the means of rendering it in this programme (x headed notes, etc. After years of a number of others as well as myself "banging on" about it, without result, I have now given up and resort to "Finale" for scoring out my percussion parts. I would hasten to add, however, that for the remaining band parts, other than drum/percussion scores, I use nothing but NWC, which I find second to none in most respects.

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #12 –
Walter:

While you're waiting for the new version of the drum conversion be sure to download the Rhythm.zip and DrumPatterns.zip from the Scriptorium.
http://nwc-scriptorium.org/helpful.html
They are in the NWC Files section.

These files may be helpful when writing your drum parts.

---------------
Barry Graham
Top Brass Events Band
Melbourne, Australia

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #13 –
>>>In other words, when I compose drum parts for midi, the final drum staff will make no sense to a drummer? If so I would then have to prepare "another" score specifically for the drummer so he/she can can make sense of it?<<<

Nah, he'll get it.  I'll go a bit off topic since I play the drums a bit...

First, unless your song is extremely complex with many different and odd time signatures and changes, your drummer won't need a score.  I assume he's talented so he'll pick it up.  Hell, I have no musical background and I can pickup from my friends playing the blues.

Second, if I were your drummer, I'd like you to write the drums in Noteworthy the way you want it to sound, and simply play me the file so I can listen to it.  Waaaaaay more simple that way.

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #14 –
I have just completed a "user friendly" version of the Drum Midi file to Notation program.
It runs under Windows with a Windows type interface.

Details on the NoteWorthy newsgroup.

----------------------
Barry Graham
Top Brass Events Band
Melbourne, Australia

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #15 –
While the notes used in noteworthy on MIDI chanell 16 are not absolutely related to proper drum notation, there is some relevance with regards to the drums (i.e. the base drum, toms and snare).

If you want to provide your drummer with a set of sheets for him to play from then ask him to explain to you drum notation, find a suitable percussion font and start writing.

If however you are generating MIDI drums with the intention of recording an MP3 at the end of it, then it is a different story.

Being a drummer, I have developed my own way to writing MIDI drums for audio reproduction. I have my own soundfont with all my percussion gear contained in it, accented, volume varied, everything. I have assigned each tom and cymbal on a different instrument in the soundfont and hence produce a true multi-MIDI-channel score where the ride has its own staff, the base drum its own staff, the hihat it's own staff etc.

THe question you must be thinking is "why on earth so much work?". My answer to this is that accurate accenting in a single channel is a lost cause. Where the base drum may be played "fff" the hihat may be played "pp". Well, you cannot do that on a single staff.

Another reason is that I reproduce exactly what I want acoustically so that it can then be used for various purposes (post-mastering editing, live extra's and others).

In your case this approach will be useful for you to write the drums so that your drummer can reproduce them accurately. It needs you though to build your own soundfont after sampling his drumkit - and that takes some time and some practice....

Any help, email me at sterghios@yahoo.co.uk

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #16 –
"Where the base drum may be played "fff" the hihat may be played "pp". Well, you cannot do that on a single staff."

Well that is if you use volume for accents.
If you use velocity every note has its own accent.
But then you need a sequencer to do that!

I use Volume for track balance.
Expression for dynamics.
Velocity for accents.

Re: Writing for Drums and Percussion

Reply #17 –
I use Volume for track balance.
Expression for dynamics.
Velocity for accents.
I am intrigued.  Could you elaborate, please?