I need help

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I need help

2005-07-19 01:57 pm

Supposing that I have 10 fingers,
HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO PLAY RACHMANINOFF's PRELUDE IN C# MINOR?!?!?
Towards the end on one of the chords, how am I supposed to play 24 notes at the same time?
Someone with experience please help me.

Re: I need help

Reply #1 – 2005-07-19 02:23 pm

Hmmm...

(a) Ask a friend to help you.

(b) Delete all the note that you think are unimportant. If someone complains that it is not the way Mr. R. wrote it, reply "What did he know about music?"

(c) Use something such as a blackboard eraser (unchalked) to strike multiple notes simultaneously, if they are adjacent. I have seen this done in performance by a contemporary musician who was playing something that is the work of an apparently well-known modern composer.

(d) Evolve.

Re: I need help

Reply #2 – 2005-07-19 02:59 pm

Use Hermione's Special Spell:
Multidigitalem Pianofortam!

Re: I need help

Reply #3 – 2005-07-20 07:00 am

I don't have any pianist friends. But I'll try removing some notes.

Re: I need help

Reply #4 – 2005-07-20 07:16 am

Hi Daniel,
I'm not a pianist either but you might try this:
Those parts where you don't have enough fingers, could you use the sustain pedal and run a quick arpeggio?

Lawrie

Re: I need help

Reply #5 – 2005-07-20 08:25 am

Hi again Daniel,
perhaps one of the following combinations will give an idea? The first bar is supposed to represent what you have written, the second is probably no good at all but the others may be useful - I dunno, like I said, I'm no pianist. BTW the example is only 13 notes, not 24 but I'm sure you'll get the idea.

Lawrie

Code: [Select · Download]

!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|Clef|Type:Treble
|TimeSig|Signature:4/4
|Chord|Dur:Whole|Pos:-13,-11,-9,-6,-4,-2,1,3,5,8,10,12,15
|Bar
|SustainPedal|Pos:-8|Wide:Y
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:-13|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam=First
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:-11|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:-9|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:-6|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:-4|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:-2|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:1|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:3|Opts:Stem=Up,Beam=End
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:5|Opts:Stem=Down,Beam=First
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:8|Opts:Stem=Down,Beam
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:10|Opts:Stem=Down,Beam
|Note|Dur:32nd|Pos:12|Opts:Stem=Down,Beam
|Note|Dur:8th|Pos:15^|Opts:Stem=Down,Beam=End
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:15
|SustainPedal|Status:Released|Pos:-8|Wide:Y
|Bar
|SustainPedal|Pos:-8|Wide:Y
|Chord|Dur:8th|Pos:-13,-11,-9,-6|Opts:Stem=Up
|Chord|Dur:8th|Pos:-4,-2,1,3|Opts:Stem=Up
|Chord|Dur:8th|Pos:5,8,10,12|Opts:Stem=Down,Beam=First
|Note|Dur:8th|Pos:15^|Opts:Stem=Down,Beam=End
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:15
|SustainPedal|Status:Released|Pos:-8|Wide:Y
|Bar
|SustainPedal|Pos:-8|Wide:Y
|Chord|Dur:8th|Pos:-13,-11,-9,-6,-4,-2|Opts:Stem=Up
|Chord|Dur:8th|Pos:1,3,5,8,10,12,15^|Opts:Stem=Down
|Note|Dur:Half,Dotted|Pos:15
|SustainPedal|Status:Released|Pos:-8|Wide:Y
|Bar
|SustainPedal|Pos:-8|Wide:Y
|Chord|Dur:8th,Dotted|Pos:-13,-11,-9,-6,1,3,5,8|Opts:Stem=Up
|Chord|Dur:8th,Dotted|Pos:-6,-4,-2,1,8,10,12,15^|Opts:Stem=Down
|Note|Dur:8th|Pos:15^
|Note|Dur:Half|Pos:15
|SustainPedal|Status:Released|Pos:-8|Wide:Y
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End

Re: I need help

Reply #6 – 2005-07-20 11:41 am

Listen to a recording of it. If you are diligent, you may find one by Rachmaninoff himself. But I'm sure that Van Cliburn or Horowitz knew what to do.

BTW, there aren't 24 notes. Worst case is 12. Even so, you would have to have 6 fingers on each hand and a 4 octave reach to play it as written.

What you should have realized long before you developed the technical ability to even attempt this piece is that written notation is at best a rough approximation of performance. The same is true of poetry.

Rachmaninoff is indicating the effect that he is !B(striving for) knowing full well that it is not possible. Still, given the tempo of this piece, getting close is well within the reach of concert pianists (I'm just a humble piano player).

Look at any number of impressionist pieces, Ravel's Jeux d'Eau comes to mind, for more "utterly unplayable" examples.

Re: I need help

Reply #7 – 2005-07-20 01:02 pm

Miscounted did I?
Thanks for everything.

Re: I need help

Reply #8 – 2005-07-21 06:16 pm

I have actually heard a CD recording of a piano-roll
that Rachmaninov made of the prelude.

If I remember correctly, he split the big chords the same
way that string players do: he first hit the lower notes of
the chord, and then quickly hit the upper notes.

HTH

Re: I need help

Reply #9 – 2005-07-21 07:02 pm

I also have only 10 fingers, but I'm no piano player, so I don't need any help on this.

May I suggest, for your next postings, to use a more specific description in the subject text ?

Re: I need help

Reply #10 – 2005-07-25 10:48 am

Thanks, tip. Youv'e been the most helpful.

Re: I need help

Reply #11 – 2005-07-25 12:43 pm

Daniel (and others who just dropped by)... Don't be put off by the first (humorous) reply to your question. It's just that anything frantic and capitalized (or in the case of others, terribly mis-spelled) is sure to bring out the worst.

Re: I need help

Reply #12 – 2005-07-26 12:32 am

I play (let's just use that term loosely) Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue, and Mussourgsy's Picture's at an Exhibition, as well as hunt-and-peck Rach's Prelude (his worst piece, in his opinion).

They all have requirements for more than ten notes being played at a time. The answer? Don't play them all at the same time. As alluded to above, you need to split the chords. You will often find that they are written for "one big splash down here" followed by "one big splash up here". At least, they sound better if you play the lower notes of each stave first, followed by the higher ones. You will most likely want to use the pedal, but that may depend upon how accurate you are with your chords! If only one staff requires the splitting of notes (normally the left hand), play the lower notes of it first, and then the right hand together with the top notes of the left. The trick is to try and get the split working as quickly as possible. This comes with lots of practice, something I never do these days, hence my constant lifting of the sustain pedal! ;-)

HTH,
A

Re: I need help

Reply #13 – 2005-07-26 06:04 pm

or you could hang around a nuclear reactor until you had the required number of digits

Re: I need help

Reply #14 – 2005-07-26 07:19 pm

Oh no, that won't work. It will only affect your offspring. So you'll have to wait for years for a possible result.

Re: I need help

Reply #15 – 2005-07-26 11:07 pm

Surely, Rach's music will be around that long...

Re: I need help

Reply #16 – 2005-07-27 02:42 am

Picture's at an Exhibition
Pictures at an Exhibition

Re: I need help

Reply #17 – 2005-07-27 07:43 pm

I know an artist whose picture's at an exhibition. His signature is hard to read. Viewers always ask, "Who's that?"

Tonight, the symphony will play "Pictures at an Exhibition."

Re: I need help

Reply #18 – 2005-07-28 05:53 am

I fixed the problem by playing the bass notes like grace notes, playing the treble notes a split second after them, while using the pedal. It works ok.

Re: I need help

Reply #19 – 2005-08-03 12:08 am

That's the spirit!

Re: I need help

Reply #20 – 2007-05-21 10:27 pm

Quote from: Daniel – 2005-07-19 01:57 pm

Supposing that I have 10 fingers,
HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO PLAY RACHMANINOFF's PRELUDE IN C# MINOR?!?!?
Towards the end on one of the chords, how am I supposed to play 24 notes at the same time?
Someone with experience please help me.

Rachmaninov Had Big Hands

Re: I need help

Reply #21 – 2007-05-22 02:49 am

Yes!