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Topic: Real sounds (Read 5468 times) previous topic - next topic

Real sounds

Why is it that the instruments sound more realistic on some computers than they do on others?

Re: Real sounds

Reply #1 –
MIDI sounds different on different computers, because some computers have better musicians in them than others.  Actually, all those little musicians inside your sound card are equally technically proficient (they can all play 64th notes with ease); however some just have better tone than others.  :-)

Actually, I say that in jest, but in a sense there's truth to the above statement.  The MIDI sound you get from your computer is only as good as the sound samples that were used to generate the different sounds from your sound card.  Different manufacturers' cards have different sounds.  Some cards have a fixed set of sounds, so that's all you get.  Others, such as the Creative Live! and Audigy cards, let you use soundfonts.  Soundfonts are like typeface fonts in your word processing program (so if you don't like the default Courier New, you can change it to a fancy looking script font).  Likewise with a soundfont-capable sound card; if you don't like the sounds coming out, you can change them.  Some soundfonts are free; others you have to pay for.  You can even mix and match individual sounds from one soundfont to another.

MIDI itself isn't sound; it is only a series of commands to your soundcard to play the sounds.  MIDI can tell a channel (there are 16 of them) to play a note, for however long, with a certain instrument (sometimes called a patch or program), at a certain velocity (how hard the note is hit by the instrument), at a certain volume (how loud the note sounds for its duration), and a bunch of other commands.  The sound card then takes that information and makes the requested sound from the sound samples available to the card and you hear it.

MIDI is sort of like the conductor of the orchestra.  You can put a score in front of a symphony orchestra, and the resulting sound is wonderful.  If the conductor passes out the parts for the same score to a 7th grade youth orchestra, the resulting sound, from playing the exact same notes, will be very different from the symphony orchestra.  Mr. MIDI conducted the same way both times, but each orchestra (analagous to your sound card) sounds different.

Anyway, I hope this made sense and I'm sure others will join in and provide a more eloquent explanation.

Hope this helps,

John

Re: Real sounds

Reply #2 –
Various reasons:

(1) Could be for the same reason that some music sounds better on a good stereo system than it does on a cheap boombox. Factors that affect this are available power, fidelity of conversion from digital to analog, size and mounting of speakers, electrical noise. There are also various user adjustments (bass/treble, etc.) that can be done with computer audio, just as for stereo systems. Maybe different computers have different user adjustments.

In the case of aduio formats such as WAV or MP3, if the same file sounds better or worse on different systems, the above reasons are the only ones to consider.

(2) If the file is NWC native, MIDI, or Karaoke, then there is an additional complication (as well as all of the above). These files contain computer instructions, rather than audio information. Different computers will process the instructions differently. In particular, the computer must call its own "synthesized instruments" to play the musical instructions. Cheap systems have small, cheap-sounding synth instruments. That's particularly true of most laptops, since the end-use typically does not require high fidelity, and well as for desktop computers intended for office use, where audio rarely gets past the occasional beep.

In cases where the computer allows installation of alternative sound cards, it may be possible to purchase and install a better-quality sound card than the one that came with the computer. A better sound card has better hardware and a better database of synth instruments. It probably also allows the user to load additional synth instruments, or change the existing ones.

Even if the computer does not allow an alternative sound card, it is possible to purchase (in some cases, get free) synth instrument database software that is much better than the one that came with the computer. This forum has various threads that offer advice. Use the search capability.

(3) Sometimes, a MIDI file will call for an instrument that is propritary. If a computer doesn't have that software or hardward, it may substitute some other instrument, with poorer resulting sound.

(4) In a few cases, MIDI music is originally composed in the expectation that a poor-quality synth instrument will be used. If the file is played on a better system, the use of better instruments may have unexpected effects.

Re: Real sounds

Reply #3 –
To illustrate the difference betwwen sounds produced by different synth software, download this:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ergosum/misc/2001demo.zip

The above link will expire on March 31, 2003. If You try it after that, the file will be gone.

The ZIP file contains a MIDI file of the opening bars of "Also Sprach Zarathusra" by Ricard Strauss, also known as the opening theme for the movie "2001: A Space odyssey." In addition to the MIDI file are two audio files (WMA format) that have been recorded from the MIDI using two different synth software methods.

Different computers will play the MIDI differently. The two audio files sound different from each other, but do not depend on the synth software in your own computer.
 

Re: Real sounds

Reply #4 –
Robert,

Which size your file?

Re: Real sounds

Reply #5 –
Ramón: The file is 1.17 MB.
Robert: Ok, so QT stands for QuickTime, but what's the other one?
Sincerely,
Francis Beaumier
Green Bay, WI

Re: Real sounds

Reply #6 –
QT does indeed stand for Quicktime 6. The other one was made using some specialized stuff that you wouldn't be able to duplicate without special software (not generally available). It relies on an enormous digitized instrument soundbase.

Re: Real sounds

Reply #7 –
Wow, that's some demo.  Thanks, Robert.
On my system, the 2001QT file has sharper attacks than the 2001GD file, but both of them have a considerable amount of distortion, and they seem to be a bit flat.
(I was disappointed to hear that the organ was not left hanging after the rest of the orchestra cuts off...)

Re: Real sounds

Reply #8 –
Whether or not the organ was left hanging, was a property of the original MIDI file (rather than the sound databases).

The "sharper attack" on the QT audio is, I believe, because the QT does not attempt to synthesize the start of sound in horns by breath, but gets right to the synth tone. The GB inserts a transition.

I can't exhibit more files, for copyright reasons. But as I mentioned earlier, a MIDI file originally written for a low-quality soundbase may sound worse with a better-quality soundbase. The QT soundbase is middling, GB better. GB does a particularly good job on drumming, piano, and pipe organ. QT seems to do a better job on sounds intended to be synth.

Any of you SBlive, Audigy, etc. users care to comment?

Re: Real sounds

Reply #9 –
I recently "upgraded" (and I use that term very loosely) to W98SE from W95c, and no longer have the codecs to play WMAs. Robert, do you know of a simple way to get these codecs without having to install the whole bloated Mplayer 9?

I'd be happy to post Yamaha XG and maybe Roland GS (DirectX - aka "Microsoft Synthesizer") files for comparison, should anyone be interested.

Re: Real sounds

Reply #10 –
Wups - never mind about the codecs. Mplayer managed to find and download them on its own. (And amazingly enough, it even worked!)

Next question - where do you find an encoder for this format?

Re: Real sounds

Reply #11 –
Fred: Microsoft has the encoder free on its website. Go there, to the Windows Media series developer downloads. If you don't want the version 9 encoder, the version 7.1 is just fine. You don't need the "encoding toolkit," just the encoder.

A nice feature of WMA format is that audio can be encoded for transmission via 28 or 56K modem, if you wish. The result is a lot better than low-end mp3.

Everyone: I have uploaded another sample. This one doesn't have the (professionally-prepared) MIDI, just a couple of short audios of the MIDI prepared using two different synth databases:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ergosum/misc/atbl.zip

The file will be removed on March 31, 2003. Download size 914K. It's a guitar lick from Van Halen's "Ain't Talking 'Bout Love." There is a BIG difference in audio quality.

Re: Real sounds

Reply #12 –
FWIW: QuickTime uses Roland GS for synth.  That sounded so nice to Microsoft that they included it in Windows XP.  Therefore, QuickTime soundes exactly the same as the Windows MIDI mapper on my system.
Sincerely,
Francis Beaumier
Green Bay, WI

Re: Real sounds

Reply #13 –
Ah, I had wondered about that. My current system is XP. But my earlier W98 system did not use the "standard" MS sound base, and so sounded quite different from Quicktime. (It was not as good as QT.)

Re: Real sounds

Reply #14 –
A recording from Yamaha XG (specifically DB60XG) is available for a limited time at the following URL:

http://www3.telus.net/dogstarmusic/other/2001xg.zip

Sorry, I didn't bother with the wma thing, but rather encoded it as a VBR mp3. Unless you have a very very old mp3 player, you shouldn't have difficulty playing it.

Re: Real sounds

Reply #15 –
Robert: I did not mean to imply that you are the cause for the lack of organ.  Sorry if it sounded that way.  btw I am a SBlive user.
Wow, Fred's xg file sounds pretty realistic on my machine.  When I grow up, I wanna be as good as you guys at this stuff.