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Topic: More than 16 channels? (Read 5116 times) previous topic - next topic

More than 16 channels?

Is it possible to use more than 16 channels in a composition by using a second sound bank? If so, how is that done in NWC? And will it then export to MIDI?

Re: More than 16 channels?

Reply #1 –
Hi Bob,

Using more than 16 channels is a hardware thing.
Not much software supports more than 16 channels.
When you think about it though, You can get by without more than 16 channels. Even for orchestral composition or multilayered techno stuff you don't need any more than 16 channels.
Maybe you need to look at your application and try and do it more efficiently?

not the real funny guy, (but one of the funny guys)

Re: More than 16 channels?

Reply #2 –
The MIDI standard does not support more than 16 channels with one device. However, by using more than one device port, you can get around this limitation. If you have more than one device, you can select them via Tools | Options | MIDI. Then, you can seelct which device to use on a per-staff basis in Staff Properties.

Example: You can use up to 16 channels of your sound card's internal synthesizer, and 16 more channels via an outboard synthesizer connected via a MIDI cable (usually to the joystick port of the sound card).

Re: More than 16 channels?

Reply #3 –
When I tried this (to mix the different sounds) the two devices were slightly out of synch, which was a good imitation of a beginner's band.

Re: More than 16 channels?

Reply #4 –
Right on Blair.
If one (or more) of your device is a software synth. the delay in processing the midi note ons in the software synth will certainly put them out of sync.

Re: More than 16 channels?

Reply #5 –
>>When you think about it though . . . Even for orchestral composition . . . you don't need any more than 16 channels.

I've run up against the 16-channel problem at least once. Even when I think about it.

Be that as it may, when I save an NWC song requiring more than one playback device to a MIDI file, I'm not at all happy with the results. t seems that the Windows 98 Media Player won't use more than one playback device at a time. Is this even supported? How would I go about making it work?

Re: More than 16 channels?

Reply #6 –
Correct. The Midi Mapper, and by extension the Media Player, only support 16 channels. You can map to multiple devices within those 16 channels, but that is it. In addition, using multiple devices more or less precludes mass distribution, as most people will not be able to hear the parts beyond those on the first device (or, in the case of some players, the additional parts will be played on the single device, just making everything sound wrong).

Re: More than 16 channels?

Reply #7 –
Amen to that! In sequencing orchestral work, it's a constant struggle to fit everything into 15 channels (channel 10 is unusable, being strictly for percussion instruments; you can't even us it for pitched percussion like timpani). Part of the reason is that I like to double the strings on two different sounds, since the string ensemble sounds on most cards lack the detail required for fast passages. By using multiple devices on my system, it can sound fine to me but I have no idea what's going to happen on other peoples' systems. So I grin and bear it... and double instruments on a single channel if needed.

Re: More than 16 channels?

Reply #8 –
the other funny guy was right.
you work out how many sections there are in a standard orchestra - that's less than 16 including percussion. th trouble comes when you use more than one channels for string sounds, separate channels for individuals instruments eg. bass clarinet etc.
cheers

Re: More than 16 channels?

Reply #9 –
How can you help assigning separate channesl for individual instruments? If I assign multiple staves to the same channel, they play back with the same instrument patch regardless of my "Staff Properties" settings. If you mean having different instruments *serially* on the same channel, wouldn't this be too limiting? ("No, I can't add the bassoons to this chord, the clarinets are already playing.")

Also, it was my understanding that certain effects (e.g., pitch bend) were applied on a per-channel basis, so assigning all strings (or even all violins) to the same channel is out if you want one section to be playing a glissando others are not.

I'll admit that this is one of the times I'd rather be wrong. If there are ways around these problems I'd love to hear about them.

Re: More than 16 channels?

Reply #10 –
On a Sound Blaster Live! (I have one), it is just a matter of assigning the first 15 channels to A:SBLive! MIDI Synth, and the last 15 to B:SBLive!... The only time I've had to use more than 15 channels on an orchestral piece was when I sequenced Bach's St. Matthew Passion's first chorus in NWC (not some Klavier Auszug, but a full score). It worked like a charm - on a 700 MHz Duron system, the off-synch was not that noticeable.
Anyway, a notice to everyone that would like to use more than two devices:
- NWC processes scores from top to bottom. That means that when you use staff 1 with device A, channel 1, you should use staff 2 with device A, channel 2, etc., staff 15 with device A, channel 16, staff 16 with device B, channel 1. I've seen scroes with a different mapping: staff 1 with device A, channel 1, staff 2 with device B, channel 1. Looks neat, perhaps (esp. when you group same instruments on same channels), but switching between devices slows playback significantly down.