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Topic: Duplets (Read 5696 times) previous topic - next topic

Duplets

When writing in Simple time it is easy to include a triplet but I cannot find a way of writing a duplet when writing in compound time; ie, to divide a single beat (dotted crotchet) into two equal notes. I have to do this:
(quaver + semi-quaver tied)and ...
(semi-quaver + quaver tied)
Which of course is not the correct way to notate it.

Does someone know how this can be done?

Re: Duplets

Reply #1 –
I just use two dotted eighths (quavers), beamed if applicable.

Re: Duplets

Reply #2 –
Thanks Fred, for your suggestion but two dotted eighth's is not the correct way to notate a duplet in compound time. I am a music teacher and my printed examples have to be correct.
In simple time a triplet is beamed with a "3" to tell the performer to divide the beat into 3 equal parts.
In compund time a duplet has to be beamed with a "2" to tell the performer to divide the beat ( which is normally divided into 3) into 2 equal parts.

Re: Duplets

Reply #3 –
Sorry, there's no notationally correct way of doing this at this time. My suggestion works from a midi (playback) standpoint, but I agree that it's right from a visual (theory) standpoint.

Re: Duplets

Reply #4 –
Well, ok... I spoke a bit too soon. There are ways of post-processing NWC printouts using the Print Preview Copy function, to generate either a bitmap or a windows metafile of the current page. From there you could edit the file further in an external application. Several folks have worked with metafiles (see the recent "Printing" thread for some tips). I've successfully used the bitmap option followed by editing in Paint Shop Pro (and subsequent conversion to PostScript format for publishing) to do things like upside-down clefs and similar shenanigans.

Re: Duplets

Reply #5 –
At the time being, Fred's answer is the best answer (but you can also use Word with WMF format).

Hoping this will be possible in next version (don't know when it's planned though), so don't despair :-)

If you're in a hurry, the simplest way is dotted eights (which _is_ correct but not much used), and manually (I mean not in NWC) removing dots and adding a *2* at the proper place.
BTW, that's how my li'l brother understood a duplet in compound measure :-)

HTH anyway

Re: Duplets

Reply #6 –
Thanks from "down under" for all your help. I can now work my way around the problem. Great support.

Re: Duplets

Reply #7 –
An addendum re: dotted eighth's. If this is not a "notationally correct" way to represent duplets, someone tell Benjamin Britten. He did it that way more than once.

Re: Duplets

Reply #8 –
Thanks Grant,
My original question has been answered by others who understood that I simply wanted to know if there was a way,using "Noteworthy Comp" , to notate a duplet in the correct way. Clearly it is not - but I can now get around it.
I'm sure you are right about Benjamin B. Most astute of you.

Re: Duplets

Reply #9 –
N-tuplets can be done (with a little work) in version 1.55. Here is how. This example is for a 5-tuplet taking the place of 2 eighth notes.

1) Insert the 5 notes and beam them. Insert text just before the notes, Preserve Width off, and use Staff Italic to insert a "5" with leading spaces so it appears in the right place. Use Print Preview to make sure it will look right in the printout.

2) That was easy. Now we must clean up the mess in the other staves. We have added 3 extra eighth notes, so we must compensate by adding 3/8 rests to the other staves. In my example I have a quarter note below the 5-tuplet, so I stretch it by adding a dotted quarter rest. If there were two eighth notes I would stretch both with dotted eighth rests. Now, select the rest, edit it (Ctrl-E) and set the Vertical Offset property so the rest appears below the staff. Now you can manually white it out on the printout. This will produce a stuccato effect on the playback. You could fix this by tying in notes instead of rests, but there is no way to hide them.

3) That looks OK, but sounds wrong. We are playing 5 notes in the space of 2, so we Insert Tempo before the 5-tuplet, and use a value of 5/2 times the original tempo. In this example the tempo was 80, so the new tempo is 80x5/2 = 200. Put the tempo back to 80 after the 5-tuplet. Turn off the Preserve Width and Display Tempo checkboxes so the tempo does not appear on the printout.

4) If you do Audit Bar Lines, the song will be trashed. This can be fixed by adjusting the Time Signature. We have added 3 eighth notes, so the original 3/4 gets converted to 9/8 (3/4 + 3/8 = 6/8 + 3/8 = 9/8). Do this for each measure in the n-tuplet column, then set the next measure back to 3/4. Of course, this will look wrong in the printout.

This example file can be downloaded using (unfortunately only) Internet Explorer:
http://music.acmecity.com/recording/273/5_nTuplet.nwc

Re: Duplets

Reply #10 –
Well, this whole stream just reinforces in my own mind that the one really pressing notational need for NWC (which I LOVE), is a need to notate in tuplets other than 3. I will just keep requesting and crossing my fingers... It really is about the only thing missing that I just can't seem to live without. This is especially true when I am inputting Debussy and the like!

I just had to rant...

Re: Duplets

Reply #11 –
To Blair Dowden's reply:
Thanks, first off. Yep, I've played with all that, and it just never is all that successful, never mind the expenditure of labor for the process. I need something that will look AND sound right, and having mulitple versions just seems like an awful waste. It would seem that if triplets are possible to program in, so, too, would multiples other than 3.
Another triplet related gripe, to keep with my theme, is the fact that importing midi files with triplets NEVER works quite right and requires extensive labor to tweak.
But, as I always say, NoteWorthy is still, in my opinion, ht best bang for the buck you could want...

Re: Duplets

Reply #12 –
Importing triplets is a common problem with big band files.

The best work around is to set up a macro with the old Win3.1 recorder that will convert the 16th/8th/16th group to a true 1/8th triplet.

Many NWC users use macros to do all sorts of neat things like clef changes etc.

If you have access to the Scriptorium there is a link to the source of the macro recorder and there is probably a suite of NWC macros on the Scriptorium or elsewhere at this site.

If you have difficulty with this Email me - I may be able to help.

Barry Graham