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Topic: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC (Read 11998 times) previous topic - next topic

Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

In a few weeks I may have some spare time that I intend to use as follows: My main use of NWC is to print SATB choir music. I would like to create another font that can be used as "text" within NWC to achieve some effects not otherwise available (or hard to do). No promises! I may or may not find the time.

Since the font is primarily for my own use, I already know what will be in it: (1) A variety of "tilted" slurs, of going up or down from one position to an octave, curved upwards or downwards, at several lengths; (2) Some "dotted" ties, used when there are a different number of syllable per lyric line; (2) Pre-made "reminder" accidentals in parentheses; (3) Pre-made notes slightly smaller than regular NWC notes, but bigger than grace notes; (4) A few pre-made X-head notes for spoken word; (5) A few multi-measure rests.

There may be a few spare code positions left over. Do any of you have a suggestion as to what I would put there? Let me know by E-mail: ra849-at-icogitate-dot-com (decode to reply). Expiration date: January 15, 2001.

Please limit suggestions to those useful in SATB choral, not otherwise available in other NWC user fonts.

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #1 –
How about notes like |O| which come up in chant like songs.

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #2 –
Yes, that's part of my original plan. Single and double bard around the whole note.

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #4 –
One for the wish list to Eric: Some tenor parts use a double treble clef (that sounds weird, doesn't it?).
I can't think of any kind of workaround for this which would print and play correctly.

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #5 –
supposing it's for 15/01/2002 :)
For ||o|| notes, it's already present in the boxmarks font, or in boxmark2. If you want |o| note, please tell me.

Current version of boxmark2 beta (with a .nwc example) is at http://www.multimania.com/madmarsu/Nwc/boxmark2.zip
More details WILL be available in the boxmark2 page :)

What is a "double treble clef"?

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #6 –
Is January 15, 2001 too late to announce? Hah! Not for me! While mere computer geeks may have had a Y2K problem, sophisticated musicians have a Y2K+2 problem! Thanks for pointing this out, my friend in Istanbul.

I'm not sure what a double-treble clef is. Any example on-line of artwork that I can look at?

Keep those comments coming.

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #7 –
A double treble clef is just two single ones side by side, but it's rare to find it in modern typography.

I you want to use it then it is easy enough to put it on the first system (just type a treble clef twice) but I can't see how to replicate it on subsequent systems :-( except by doing it the hard way.

Peter

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #8 –
Peter, your explanation on how it looks is clear.
the reason why someone invented it, I have no clue, especially if the notes are read the same (2nd line is still a G I suppose). The usual G clef 8lower is good enough, so unless you want to print an already existing score, I don't see the need.
Is it used on ancient music only?

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #9 –
The double treble clef is identical in function to the treble clef with hanging '8', but in my experience the double clef is much, much rarer. I've personally only seen it in very old (100+ years) scores; modern ones always have the hanging '8' clef.

There's a third equivalent clef that looks like a combination of the standard treble clef and a C clef centered on the third space; I've only seen this in French scores (e.g., IIRC, the Duruflé Requiem, published by Durand).

Since all of these clefs mean exactly the same thing, I don't see any reason that music with either the old double treble clef or the combination treble/C clef couldn't and shouldn't be transcribed using the equivalent hanging '8' treble clef that NWC provides and that (AFAIK) all tenors know how to read.

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #10 –
Useful or not, specialized clefs would not be suitable for a text font, since they would not be automatically printed on each system. But you knew that!

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #11 –
I think that depends. A number of text items are sensitive to the placement of system breaks, but that doesn't make them unusable. I'm thinking, for example, of long hairpins in the Crecendo font, which have to be broken into two short hairpins if they happen to cross a system break. Once you're doing this degree of print formatting, it's not much more difficult to determine where the breaks fall and then insert text clefs in the appropriate places.

However, having said this I'll stick to my previously expressed opinion, which is that special octave-lower treble clefs aren't really necessary (unless for some reason one is aiming to reproduce the exact look of a score that uses them, in which case NWC is probably not the right tool in the first place).

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #12 –
>While mere computer geeks may have had a Y2K problem, sophisticated musicians have a Y2K+2 problem!

Well actually, Y2K refers to the series of problems that were supposed to happen in 2000 and beyond. I guess this was one of the ;-)

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #13 –
Ah, I found the correct message thread, this time!

This is the font that I will start to work on, January 21, 2002. Last chance for suggestions!

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #14 –
Well, this is just to say that I've added "reversed" (I mean upside down) clefs in current beta of boxmark2. So there is no need to include them to your font, if you intended to do so.

I'll soon give more details on *new* beta of boxmark2, anyway (it's not yet on the scripto).

Bon courage for the font generation process :)
BTW, which software do you use for this?

P.S. I can send you the current beta, but I don't have your mail. Please send it to me at marsu@europe.com if interested ;)

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #15 –
Thanks, Marsu. You found my correct E-mail.

Why use an upside-down clef??? Never mind, it's probably some musical style that I can't sing, unless I am standing on my head!

For all who are curious: I use "Typetool," a light font editor by the folks who make FontLab. It does some things, doesn't do others. But it will create a TT font, if you do not need professional results (professional fonts have more extensive hinting, and possibly bitmap inclusion for small point sizes). I understand that most current work in fonts is in 2-byte unicode, which TypeTool cannot do.

A good idea is to get the "Font properties editor" for Windows from the Microsoft web site. This allows you to enter a lot more information in the font's properties. For example, you could enter the purpose of the font, or how to use it.

I expect that my new slur font will be done in a few days.

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #16 –
The upside-down clefs were included for people like australians (for me) who live in the other hemisphere :^)

More seriously, it was included to allow some "special" music sheet such a Mozart's work that you can play with the score upside down. (you'll have to enter the key signature by hand though, even if I have also included the bemol (plus natural and sharp, which was not needed indeed) in the font either, they can not be placed automatically at the end of the staves (which is the beginning, in upside-down presentation).

Oh, I couldn't resist to add this: you're talking of the "Font properties editor" for Windows, by µ$. But do they mention somewhere that TrueType font was invented by Apple, and that windows 3.1x would never have been what it was without this new format of font?? In a programmer book they wrote, they intensively talk about all the advantages it has, why windows is now so quick and flexible for wysiwyg (sic), but only at the end of that book do they mention that TT fonts were made available thanks to Apple... well, let's say it was fair enough from µ$ to mention it once :)

PS. Typetool is visible at http://www.fontlab.com/html/typetool.html (USD 99).
P.P.S Do not buy TransType if you want to make fonts for Mac, too. Get TTConvert, freeware (on macintosh): go and read the interesting page of ebionite:
http://members.tripod.com/~ebionite/fonts.htm

HTH!

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #17 –
"The upside-down clefs were included for people like australians (for me) who live in the other hemisphere :^)"

That's only because you believe you live in a right hand rule universe.
I live in a left hand rule universe - it is you who is upside down! ;)

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #18 –
I sing Bass. But with an upside-down clef, I can sing Mozart's music Bass-ackwards!

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #19 –
Oh, Barry!! Telling me that I'm living in a right-hand rule universe is ALAS so true... Because I'm left-handed, and 'tis each day that I can see this world is made by/for right-handed persons!!!

Except the Command-C/Command-V (oops, Ctrl-C on a PC), which is much easier for left-handed persons (not to mention the Alt+F4 which is contrary to elementary rules of type-writing)...
Finally, being a left-handed person is not so bad provided you leave the mouse to the right of the kbd: most of the quick-keys are made with the left hand :^P

Well, what about to leave France and go southern?..

Oh, btw, who think that W.A.Mozart was also a left-handed person?? He was told to have a "diabolic" left hand for it was rather difficult for pianists... Personnally I think that it's typical for a left-handed person. I always found annoying the left-hand parts on a piano (well, at least for the first beginning years).

Being a contra-bass singer, if I sing upside-down I go back in the past, when I was a contra-soprano child. Thanks Mozart!

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #21 –
The NWslurs font is now posted on the Scriptorium.

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #22 –
Very good, particularly the upside down pause, but a few points to query:

Would it be possible to make the space character smaller so that it could be used for fine tuning character spacing.

Could the accidentals have a bit of trailing space so that they sit more naturally (sorry) before the note.

I like the 75% characters, but could you include clefs too so that clef changes (always notated at a smaller size) can be accommodated.

***********

As always with add-on fonts, it does result in non-portable files, and we are running out of user fonts once we've loaded NWCV15, Boxmark2, Crescendo and NWSlur. There are vast acres of space inside NWCV15 that could be used for the fixed characters/symbols at minimal effort, and those of variable length (crescendos etc) are surely ripe for development as drawn objects. One can only live in hope!

Peter

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #23 –
Peter:

I will post a slightly-revised version of the font in the near future (the font file has a version number, so you will be able to tell which is which).

(1) Smaller space: Rather than change the existing space, I will add a reduced-size space at another code location. There are a couple of unused locations that I reserved for just such afterthoughts.

(2) Accidental space before notes: Yes, to be adjusted.

(3) Reduced-size clefs: If there are enough code positions left, yes. Meanwhile, you could use the font at different point sizes.

As for portability, that is necessarily a problem whenever non-platform fonts are used in any application. My fonts, besides being free, are embeddable in PDF or word processor documents that support embedding. The NWslurs font is intended for occasional use when you need to print something immediately (I will use it for SATB hymns).

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #24 –
Thanks for prompt response.

A possible problem with a small space (especially in Character Map utilities such as 'Typecase which I had not come across before) is being able to find it - by its very nature you can't see it!

Yes certainly one can use fonts at different sizes, but this uses up a precious user font. Hence my earlier final point about fonts in general. cetainly you can embed these in some programs, but not in an NWC file, and hence my request for an enhancement, either to be able to embed font files (particularly in the Browser Plugin), or that NWC addresses the problem directly. In the meantime your fonts are very welcome and solve some otherwise intractable problems.

A hint to users if I may. To hide a slur, tie a slurred hidden grace note to the front of the first note. Then you can pop in one of Robert's improvements.

[BTW this technique can also be used to lengthen the playback of staccato notes - a side effect, I believe, already posted to the Newsgroup by Fred]

Peter

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #25 –
> [BTW this technique can also be used to lengthen the playback
> of staccato notes - a side effect, I believe, already posted
> to the Newsgroup by Fred]

Indeed. And discovered by Peter -- just to be perfectly clear about giving credit where due.

Fred

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #26 –
I just submitted version 1.02 of the font to the Scriptorium (look for it in a couple of days). I added a micro-space at the letter "t". I also made some adjustment to the cursor width on the accidentals, but you need to read the instructions (accompanies the font) for best results.

For reasons of vertical scaling, I was not able to include properly-sized clefs. You can always get them from NWCV15 defined as a user font.

If anyone else has more suggestions for this particular font, keep them bottled for awhile, as I don't have more time to work on it.

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #27 –
Robert,

thank you very much for the new font.
However, some characters are redondant with some other fonts; it may be a good thing (only one font to include), but may be what a pity not to coordinate all these efforts in new fonts! the "p" character (upside down pause) was already in boxmark2, as well as the double-whole (the one with double bars).
It would be a good thing to have one place to coordiante all of this, what do you think of this? Since it seems many (well, some) of us have the ability to create fonts, which gives many new possibilities to the users :^)

Fontly yours,
Marsu

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #28 –
I agree that it would be good to have some coordination with the various fonts projects in process.

I believe that the majority of user needs can be accomplished with one more-or-less standard font, with other fonts dedicated for specialised needs ("jazz" looking fonts, ancient music, etc.). Ideally it would also have a nod from NoteWorthy Software, perhaps even being included in the distribution package.

I personally keep my fonts files to a bare minimum, and find it a real nuisance to have to load specialised fonts for individual files. It's different, of course, in published material where custom fonts can be embedded in pdf or ps files. But for nwc files that are published or otherwise distributed, I think it best to have a de-facto "standard" such as Boxmarks has been for the last few years.

Just my two bits' worth...

Font regards,
Fred

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #29 –
Good ideas! Actually, I was aware of the symbols in other user fonts, since I looked at them first. But there were a couple of symbols in the other fonts that I use regularly, so I put them into my own font (to keep fonts to a minimum, as you wrote).

Tilted slurs, as a user-defined font, is a bad idea. I am hoping that my "NWslur" font will soon become obsolete.

Incidentally, I only work on fonts when I am away from home (using a laptop) rather than watch silly programs on TV. I do not know how our world-wide friends find their local TV, but some of the ones here (USA) are particularly asinine. I did most of the work for "NWslur" while avoiding "Judge Judy."
 

Re: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

Reply #30 –
***Tilted slurs, as a user-defined font, is a bad idea.
I am hoping that my "NWslur"
font will soon become obsolete.***

I agree.
The slurs in the program itself should follow the contour
of the music, and not simply be parallel to the staff.
Maybe NoteWorthyComposer1.80 will take care of this.
And btw, when is it due out?