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Topic: Beaming across Bar Lines (Read 7097 times) previous topic - next topic

Beaming across Bar Lines

Hi all-

Is there any practical way to beam across bar lines using NWC V1.75B? If not, does V2 support this?

Thanks

Peter Payzant

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #1 –
You may insert a barline as a text item (piece of cake in a part, sometimes tricky in a score...).  You will then need to add a hidden barline to compensate for the measure numbering.

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #2 –
Thanks for the suggestion - looks promising! What character would you suggest to use for the "text" bar line? Something from one of the fonts in the Scriptorium, or good ol' ASCII "|", very large?

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #3 –
You can do it using layered staffs with hidden rests and visible bar lines on one layer, and notes on the other.  You'll need to pad the last note of one bar by adding a little text based space after it, because the bar line from the other staff will be too close to the first note of the purported second bar of the first staff.

Why would you want to, though?  The beams are meant to show groupings of notes by beats.  So far as I'm aware, beats don't cross bar lines.  If you're dealing with a two bar or more syncopated passage, you would still beam within the bar, and use a tie to cross from the last 8th note in bar 1 to the first note in bar 2.

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #4 –
What I'm trying to do is transcribe a handwritten score (not mine!) into Noteworthy so that I can print clear parts. Yes, it has long syncopated sequences, but unfortunately using a tie across the bar lines isn't appropriate because the note changes as you cross the bar line.

Looks as though I'll have to experiment with hidden staves. Thanks for your help.

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #5 –
Top-of-the-head comment -- means I haven't tried it.  If, instead of hidden (never visible) rests in the layer with the bar line you use hidden and muted notes (without the beam) I think the padding would not be needed.

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #6 –
Why would you want to, though?
As Peter wrote, he is trying to...transcribe a handwritten score...
There are some composers who wrote beamed groupings across bar lines in the 1940s-1960s (et al?) to emphasize metric groupings, even though "it's not correct."  When I have a score/parts like that, I like to keep true to the composers intentions, so I beam across the bar lines.

I avoid using layered staffs, though, because layering causes a line (not unlike a bar line) to appear at the left end of the staff, which is quite wrong (I know this has been discussed here before, but I don't have the time to search for it right now...).  Instead, stick with my first suggestion.  I use a character from a font that I created  that actually has a bar line, designed to look just like the normal bar line.  The font has everything from Boxmarks-type characters which have been altered to fit the style of the NWCjazz font, as well as anything else I ever needed in a font (many of which will be rendered moot by NWC2...).

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #7 –
I gather, then, that to get a visually-pleasing bar line I should create a font which has at least this character available. Any hints on font creation - tools, etc.?

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #8 –
"Why would you want to, though?"

Brahms was very fond of beaming across bar lines.  The metre in his symphonies is often very variable and I suppose it saved making numerous changes of time signature.  I sometimes wonder why he bothered with bar lines at all!

Stephen

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #9 –
The font creation tool that I use is called Softy.
I am not recommending it per se.
It seems to have some glitches that have prevented me from ever finishing my font sets, but it does work to a degree.  It is one of the least expensive font creators out there, but you get what you pay for.  If I were going to make many fonts and try to sell them, I would spend $$$ on a good program whose name I forget right now but whose site is bookmarked somewhere.  I think Robert A. (who frequents this site) might recommend a good program for you.

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #10 –
I use "Typetool." This is an excellent lower-end program by the same folks who make "Fontlab." But Typetool is not cheap. Unless you really want to get into fonts, save your money. I understand that there is a less expensive "FontCreator" around, but I haven't tried it. "Softy" is, to my knowledge, obsolete.

For the described purpose, I wouldn't bother with a font. Better to use layering within NWC, if you can. Or, if you don't mind pasting NWC's metafiles into a word processing document, you can draw a line or duplicate a bar line.

You can also try using the vertical bar from your ordinary text font (Times, Arial, whatever), and placing several copies one above the other at various staff heights. That is, use several short pieces rather than one large bar. I beieve you can align the pieces so that they sit one atop another and overlap, for the effect of one continuous bar.

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #11 –
CorelDraw (at least version 8) allows you to grab a character from a font, mess with it, and save it back into the font and it's original or a new location.  I don't know how it compares in price with the other suggestions, but if you already have it, the instructions are buried somewhere in the HELP files.  I'm not home just now, so I can't check for anymore details

Cyril
 

Re: Beaming across Bar Lines

Reply #13 –
Robert-  Thanks for this, I'll give it a try. And thanks to many others who responded with helpful suggestions and illuminating discussion.