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CD burning troubles

Ok... here is my problem:

I saved a midi to my harddrive as an MP3 because a midi will not be able to be put onto a cd (audio cd, not file cd)with my cd burning program. Even though the midi is now in MP3 format (I checked this by right clicking on the file and looking at where it says "type of file) it still will not let me burn the midi that is now an MP3 onto an audio cd. Does anyone know why this is? If so, could you tell me how to fix the problem?

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #1 –
And I forgot to add this :

I do not want to buy any new software, but if there is a free program on the internet somewhere to fix my problem, I will happily download that.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #3 –
The problem may be hardware or software dependent. My own CD-burner (built into my new laptop) will accept either WAV or MP3 as input for creating audio CDs. The format stored on the CD is neither WAV nor MP3, but a format peculiar to recorded CD music.

For the benefit of all: There are two types of blank CDs, not counting the rewritables. One type, called "data CD," can be read only by computers, not by audio CD players. A data CD can store any kind of file, not just music. The other type, "music CD," can be read by computers or by audio CD players. A music CD can only store music, in a particular manner. For some reason that I do not understand, data CDs are cheaper than music CDs.

If you burn music files onto a data CD, you will not end up with a music CD. What you will have is a data CD containing music playable only by computer.

If you cannot burn a CD (especially if the process starts, but fails mid-way) it may be due to the CD itself. Not long ago, most of the discs in a particular package failed during burn (it was a major label). I changed brands, and there was no problem.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #4 –
Hmmmmmmm... Robert, I don't really understand what you are saying about music versus data CDs.  I have used blanks that were sold as "music CDs" to record .mpg, .exe, etc. type files and plain CDs to record music of all types and either kind works just fine for any type of file.  It depends on how you 'close' the CD as to whether it can be read only on a computer or on a CD player.  So, I usually just buy whatever is cheapest at the time and haven't had any problems with any of 'em.  Perhaps it has something to do with the brand of burner you use or the software you record them with?

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #5 –
Hm... I get the sense that Kiwi simply renamed the .mid file to .mp3. It's still just a midi file, putting a sign on a dog's collar that says "Cat" doesn't make it meow. Explorer simply looks at the file extension when using the "Properties" item in the right-click context menu; it doesn't actually analyze the file for its true nature.

You need to actually convert the midi file into a .wav or .mp3. There are quite a few ways of accomplishing this, and has been discussed a great length on this forum. Try a search on "midi mp3 conversion".

If this is not the case, and you still have trouble burning valid mp3 files, check for an update to your Adaptec CD burner software. Older versions didn't support mp3 drag-n-drop directly.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #6 –
Clarification: A blank CD intended for music can, indeed, be used as a data CD. But not the other way around. The blank music CD is somehow of higher quality (I am told) than the blank data CD. Thus, if your only application is to store data (including music files in any format), save money and use data CDs.

Distinguish the blank medium (music or data CD) from the manner  of its recording. For a CD player (Sony, etc.) to play the CD, (a) the blank must be of music recording quality, not the cheaper data-storage quality, AND (b) it must be recorded as CD music, not computer data. Merely dropping MP3s or WAVs onto a CD, of whatever quality, does not make the result a music CD unless the CD burner knows that is your intention.

To put this another way, to compete in an automobile race, it is necessary to have (a) an appropriate type of vehicle, AND (b) an appropriate type of driver.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #7 –
Second clarification: Blank "data" CDs, I am told, are not guaranteed to work in music CD players, Sources differ as to whether the reason is due to the reflectivity of the coating, or due to absence of pinhole defects that would not hurt data storage (the storage would simply avoid that sector), but would cause clicks when music is played real-time. Thus, it is possible that some blank data CDs will, in fact work quite well when treated as a music-recording CD.

It may also be that the manufacturers have found a simple way to charge more for certain blank CDs!

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #8 –
Third clarification (this wouldn't happen if I weren't getting to the age where I can't keep a coherent thought...)

In my own case, the distinction between blank CD types is not stated by the CD burner or its software. I actually haven't tried to create a music-CD using data-CD blank. The caution about using the correct CD type comes from the blank CD manufacturers themselves. As I was saying, maybe they've just found a way to rip me off!

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #9 –
As I was saying, maybe they've just found a way to rip me off!

I think that's the case. There's a tax surcharge (at least in Canada, don't know about the States) on CDs intended for music use; the proceeds go to big-money outfits like ASCAP, RIAA and the other fine folks who brought you the Sonny Bonehead Copyright Extension -- purportedly to repay "artists" (i.e. record companies) for lost revenue due to copying.

I routinely use only "data" CDRs for all my music, data, and mixed-mode needs. Aside from the coasters I made out of sheer stupidity, I haven't had a single problem as a result.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #10 –
Fred, if there's a surcharge in Canada, then for d*mn sure there's one in California USA, where I and the music big-boys live!

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #11 –
Well, I haven't ever found a blank CD that I couldn't put music on and play it in a CD player no matter what the CD manufacturers have to say about it, and I buy the cheapest that I can find.  They sound just as good as a pre-recorded CD bought at a music store. The manufacturers are probably just trying to get you to give them some extra cash.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #12 –
Three things:
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
1)Data CDs are readable by CD players, but you don't hear anything. What I is that the CD player unless its an RW disk realizes that there is a CD in the player and then proceeds to play it. Since there is data and not music, you don't hear anything. That is until, on my CD player, the 20 second skip protection button is pressed. Then I hear electronic squeaks.

2)When I have tried to use a data CD as a music CD, it works fine until I press that darn skip protection button, then I get the symtoms Robert A. described.

3)NWC, can we [abbr=pretty please!! This is as close as I can get to underlining the above worked only because it was flush left please underlining please please please]please[/abbr] have underline.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #13 –
Data CD's are absolutely usable for creating music CD's, like what you play in your car CD player.  They are just not guaranteed to play in all CD players, especially some of the older ones.  I have found (from personal experience, not scientific data) that the data CD's with the lighter colored surfaces (gold or close to silver) tend to work better.  The blue surfaces (while they do work in some players) do not work in all players (again, especially some of the older ones).  I have hundreds of music CD's that I've recorded onto "data CD's" that play fine in my car, on my home stereo, in my walkman, and in a boombox.

The music CD's are guaranteed to work on music CD players, but the real difference is that a royalty (to ASCAP/BMI/etc) has already been paid (with some distribution formula that I don't know about), figuring that you will be recording commercial music on them (like what you used to do with cassette tapes).  That's why they cost more.  Also, when used with home audio CD burners (the kind that go in your stereo; I don't know whether this applies to computer burners), you can only make a first generation copy.  You can't copy from the "music CD" to another "music CD".  If you want a second copy, you have to use the commercially produced CD again.  These things were put into place to appease the industry and ensure that royalties got paid for "exact" digital to digital copies.

This was all from memory from the last time I looked into this, so if my facts are just a little off, at least you got the gist.

Hope this helps,

John

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #14 –
Hi John, I had wondered about the different colors on CD blanks.  I suppose that the bluish ones are the 'data' CDs and the silver/gold types are music style.  I use them interchangeably for anything.

As far as copying from a copy, I guess that computer burners are different.  I have made a compilation music disk from several commercial disks then made copies of that disk all of which play very nicely on any boom box or CD player I've tried them on.  It might not work as well on the older players though.

I still think that it's just a plot to get more money from all us poor users. (grin)

Boy! Haven't we opened up a nice can of worms here?

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #15 –
The different colour is from the use of a different dye and a different reflective surface.  Think of a CD as a shiny surface covered with paint (dye). The CD burner uses a laser to burn holes through a light sensitive layer of dye.  Then when played back, another laser shoots a beam of light at the layer, and where there's a hole, the light reflects back.  From there, the light wave is somehow converted to an audio signal.  I have no idea how.

Different coloured dyes have different qualities, and all the dyes are light sensitive.  I understand the greener the poorer quality?  Nevertheless all your CD's should be stored in opaque cases to keep light out, since the dye is sensitive to it.

This site should tell you as much as you wish to know about CD burning, etc.:

http://www.cdrfaq.org/

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #16 –
Thanx David, that's a great site for CD info.  One further note on CD colors.  TDK has now put out a 'black' CD.  That's right, BLACK.  Well, it's not actually black, but a deep reddish purple, but it looks black until you hold it up to the light.  I suppose they chose purple because it will admit both the red and blue lasers used in CD players/recorders.  It is advertised as usable for games, audio and data storage.  (Works too, just tried one).

Have fun - The Hankster

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #17 –
Too much garbage written about CDs.Any CDR can be used to burn music or data. If music is bunrt to a CD it might not play on an audio player. The only difference between 'data cd' and 'music cd' is that the latter can  be used on stand alone portable type cdplayer/copiers to produce cd copies.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #18 –
I've been having trouble burning CDs, too.
They just seem to melt instead.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #19 –
Well, a bunson (spelling???) burner isn't exactly the best tool ;-)

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #20 –
If you do use a Bunsen burner for CDs, be sure that your computer has a firewall. :)

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #21 –
Interesting discussion on CD types, but I don't think it is actually helping to answer the original question

In order to transfer MIDI to CD, you first need to create a .wav or a .mp3 file. To do this, you need some recording software like WaveLab. While you play back the MIDI file, you digitally record the sound on the hard drive. WaveLab will show you the actual 'wave' of the sound. When you are happy with the recoring, you can safe the file as .wav or mp3. With a CD burning program, you can now burn the wav or mp3 to the disk.

I use WaveLab and Nero Burning ROM 5.5 since they came with my computer/soundcard. From the internet, you can get a demo version of Nero, I don't know where you can get free recording software. Maybe somone else can help out here.

Please don't forget to set the sample rate to 44.1 kHz 16 bit. Wave files are larger than MP3 and have a higher quality. So if you are burning CD's, I would use wav instead of mp3.

How successful you are is strongly depending on how knowledgable you are on sound recording. WaveLab allows you to normalize the sound level and add (sound)compression, reverb and other effects while in the digital domain.

PS: Don't forget to turn up the line in volume on the windows mixer, otherwise you will not be able to record anything. It took me a few hours to figure that one out......

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #22 –
Marcel, thanks for reminding us to turn up the volume on the mixer. If that's not done, then the program playing the MIDI probably cannot send its sound to the program recording the WAV.

All: There is a free program called "ALC-recorder" that is like the sound recorder that comes with Windows, except that ALC-recorder has an automatic level control and no time limit on the length of recording. I believe the latest version is 1.2. It can be downloaded at various sites (most of them German) such as

http://sac-ftp.externet.hu/sound1.html

although the above site is in Hungary.

Remember that when MIDI is recorded to WAV, the sound quality depends upon the instrument definition database used by the MIDI player. There are some programs that can play the MIDI and record it to WAV, all-in-one, but they may or may not use the instrument definition database that you expect.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #23 –
On the subject of CD burning - with so many experts here, it seems a good place to ask....
I have just treated myself to a new CD R-W (incorporating DVD player)
My previous model came with WIN ON CD which I found user friendly and adequate for my purposes - recording both data and audio. This new one comes with Nero 5.5. Neither programme is currently installed so
my questions are: which of these packages would you recommend? and what obvious differences are there?

TIA

Tina

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #24 –
This midi, to wav, to burn, has been around forever. Just download Modplug Tracker freeware from Modplug and put the midi file in and save as wav then burn.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #25 –
I can't be sure as this was quite a while ago but I think that Nero Burning ROM is the successor to Win on CD.

Either way, I would recommend nero any day.

Re: CD burning troubles

Reply #26 –
Thanks

Tina