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Topic: grace notes and duration (Read 7695 times) previous topic - next topic

grace notes and duration

Is there a way to speed up (or lessen the duration of) the grace notes?  This question was previously asked on 2000-10-26.  Has any changes been made to grace notes since then or can they be in the future?

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #1 –
As of right now, all grace notes play the same duration, regardless of the grace note selected (that is, a quarter note grace note has the same duration as a 16th note grace note).  It has been requested on the wish list by several people to have this changed, as well as allow the option to steal from the previous note, rather than the following note.  I would suggest adding your voice to the requests by visiting the wish list.

John

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #2 –
You can slow them down by tying several of them together and making all but the last one invisible. If you are using NWC2, ask over there and I will post some examples.

A Tempo mpc can speed them up. Properly done it can make them appear to sound before the beat, but this is usually more trouble than a separate "play" staff.
Registered user since 1996

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #3 –
I use them only for appearance.
I always have a hidden "play" staff.

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #4 –
I have a case where I have a whole note in a measure (4/4) and I need to have grace notes that start in the same measure and tie into the next measure.

Is there a way to do this?

Also - is there a way to make grace notes longer than a quarter note?

Thanks!!

Heather.

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #5 –
1/  The grace notes will fit before the bar line even though the bar is already filled by the whole note.

2/  You can make a grace note as big as a double dotted quarter, but that's it in NWC.  Longer notes wouldn't be grace notes, would they?  More like cues, perhaps?

To write cue notes, you can place them in a second, to be layered, staff.  For instance, enter 4 quarter notes, make their properties invisible and muted.  Then enter a grace note before each one, and presto!, you have cues.

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #6 –
Hey David!  How did I miss reading this one for so long - over 3 months?!?

Quote from: David Palmquist –

To write cue notes, you can place them in a second, to be layered, staff.  For instance, enter 4 quarter notes, make their properties invisible and muted.  Then enter a grace note before each one, and presto!, you have cues.


Mate - I reckon this needs to go into Tips & Tricks!
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #7 –
Done

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #8 –
I like to enter classical pieces into the program. The problem I have with grace notes is that in different compositions they seem to vary as to whether they are intended to "steal" time from the preceding notes or subsequent notes, and as to their duration. It seems that getting the right sound in the program often involves deviating from the printed score. I find myself using 32nds or 64ths rather than grace notes, which results in acceptable results (to my ear) but rather messy appearance. A good example is the Mozart Rondo. Someone posted a version using grace notes very straightforwardly, but I can't believe the music was intended to sound that way. Any suggestions as to how to deal with these problems?

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #9 –
G'day manning120,
there is a reasonably easy way to do it.

For those staves that need to have grace notes working differently, just create a 2nd, hidden, sounding staff and mute the visible one.

There are plenty of instructions on this forum to do it but briefly:
  • For the visible staff, make it look right then hit the mute button (while the staff is highlighted)
  • For the audible staff, make it sound right, then in staff properties, create a group called "hidden" or something equally meaningful (just type into the pull down list box) and make this staff a member of the hidden group
  • In page setup remove the 'X' from the hidden group and the staff won't display, but you'll still hear it.
Hope this helps enough...
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #10 –
Thanks so much. I'll try your suggestion. But I was also asking how grace notes should sound, which may be more a musical than a technical question. The scores I've seen don't appear to include directions on, for example, whether a grace note should "steal" from preceding or following notes or rests.

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #11 –
G'day manning,
Quote from: manning120 –
Thanks so much. I'll try your suggestion. But I was also asking how grace notes should sound, which may be more a musical than a technical question. The scores I've seen don't appear to include directions on, for example, whether a grace note should "steal" from preceding or following notes or rests.

Depends if the grace note is an appoggiatura or an acciaccatura...

The appoggiatura "steals" time from the following note - this is what the standard NWC grace note basically is though the NWC one is always the same length where in reality it steals a specific amount of time from the note it preceeds.

The acciaccatura or "crushed note" is often considered to steal time from the preceeding note, but this is not actually correct AFAIK.  All my references say that this form is played simultaneously with the note it is attached to but immediately released, hence the "crushed" appelation.  This is the one that has the slash scross the stem.
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.
 

Re: grace notes and duration

Reply #12 –
  Hi, y'all.

  Let me add my tuppence worth.  My musical dictionary - The Concise Oxford Dictionary of Music, Michael Kennedy (Editor) - says quite a lot about both "acciaccatura" and "appoggiatura", and it's not exactly as people have proposed above.  I could quote it in full, but in summary ...

  "Acciaccatura" - the small-sized grace note with crossed stem (but only if it's a single note: if two or more then they are also known as double etc appoggiatura! sic) is the "crushed" (and so usually very short) note, and it can steal time either from the succeeding note (usually: this is what Noteworthy does) or - but only in special cases - from the preceding note.  Some of us would like Noteworthy to allow this latter as an alternative.

  "Appoggiatura" - another, but different, grace note, also known as a "leaning" note.  It can be small-sized (UNcrossed) or normal-sized, and takes LOTS of time from the succeeding note ... usually a half or (if the latter's dotted) two-thirds - or, if it's a tied note, ALL of it!  There are apparently rules about this, so Noteworthy could provide this feature as a second sort of grace note.  It would be this second sort where the playing time of the note was "matched" suitably to the following note ... as some of us have requested.

  There.  I hope that was a useful and interesting tuppence worth.

  MusicJohn, 7/Apr/06