Skip to main content ↑ ↓
Topic: Hairpins present yet another problem... (Read 7216 times) previous topic - next topic

Hairpins present yet another problem...

If anyone has begun using the hairpins, you may have noticed a glitch (aside from the one where you need a previous dynamic marking to govern its vertical position).

Consider the following scenario.  A note has a dynamic marking beneath it.  The decrescendo also begins on that same note.  It lasts until the end of the note.  Go ahead, type it in and see what happens.


Here's the first instance I typed and noticed it in:
Code: [Select · Download]
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|DynamicVariance|Style:Sforzando|Pos:-11
|Chord|Dur:Half|Pos:-2,3|Opts:Diminuendo
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End

While I'm not extremely satisfied with the layout of the solution I've been able to come up with, here it is.  It's done by adding an invisible dynamic 5 positions lower:
Code: [Select · Download]
!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|DynamicVariance|Style:Sforzando|Pos:-11|
|DynamicVariance|Style:Sforzando|Pos:-16|Visibility:Never
|Chord|Dur:Half|Pos:-2,3|Opts:Diminuendo
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End

The other option I see is to use the hairpins included in the Crescendo font or a related font.  But that's not the point.  I'd like to see more functionality in this built-in feature.  If a hairpin requires a dynamic in front of it, it should at least let you put it there and be able to read it.

Anyone else have strong feelings about this?

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #1 –
Hi Bob,

Great minds think alike? 

I posted a request to the wish list just this morning about the same matter.  I asked for the dynamic in such cases to default to right justified.  This should solve your problem:

!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|DynamicVariance|Style:Sforzando|Pos:-11|Justify:Right
|Chord|Dur:Half|Pos:-2,3|Opts:Diminuendo
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #2 –
Quote from: David Palmquist –
This should solve your problem:

!NoteWorthyComposerClip(2.0,Single)
|DynamicVariance|Style:Sforzando|Pos:-11|Justify:Right
|Chord|Dur:Half|Pos:-2,3|Opts:Diminuendo
!NoteWorthyComposerClip-End



Yikes...that's not very preferrable at all, I must say.  The dynamics should always appear in line with the first note, except in certain cases where the dynamic simply won't fit due to space limitations.

See the whole note chord at the end of the first measure in the image below for an example of when there simply isn't enough space on the page to line the dynamic up with the note.  (It should be noted that around the G quadruple sharp on the upper bass staff, Noteworthy is no longer capable of entering this piece...not to mention the quiet (and seemingly tasty?) 2/4 measure at F.)



<Image Link>

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #3 –
Bob, that's insane - I love it.

Got a "big band" practice on tonight - conned 'em into playing at my sons upcoming wedding...  I'm gonna print it out and announce to 'em that I've got the "Bridal Waltz" ready for 'em to learn - then hand it out.  Should be good for a few laughs!

Thanks mate! 

[move]:)[/move]
I plays 'Bones, crumpets, coronets, floosgals, youfonymums 'n tubies.

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #4 –
One of the many wonderful graphics flying around cyberspace, getting pirated and given away... :)  My brother showed it to me after hunting it down for several months following someone telling us that their choir director had done just what you've proposed...

Now that you mention it, I'll do that for my quartet...they'll get a kick out of it!

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #5 –
Amazing graphic. 

Quote
The dynamics should always appear in line with the first note

Do you  mean in line vertically or horizontally?

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #6 –
Quote
The dynamics should always appear in line with the first note

On whose authority? I don't believe that is true and Alfred's doesn't agree either.

It says
Quote
Place the dynamic sign slightly before the notehead whenever possible

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #7 –
Quote from: David Palmquist –
Amazing graphic. 

Do you  mean in line vertically or horizontally?

Vertically.  Below.  (Or above, in certain cases.)

Quote from: Peter Edwards –
On whose authority? I don't believe that is true and Alfred's doesn't agree either.

It says

Um...I'll take a look at my music collection when I get home.  The music I was entering when I noticed was like this in the books "Wedding Music" and "More Wedding Music"

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #8 –
Quote
Vertically.

How would you align fff,  ffp, sfz or ppp under a note if the notehead is narrower than the character string? 

Would you have the dynamic beginning align with the left side of the notehead, under the centre, or perhaps have it right justified to line up with the right side of the notehead?  Some variation? 

What would you do if there was a chord with clustered notes, by which I mean that has noteheads both sides of the stem?  And would you treat whole notes, which are wider than quarter notes, differently?

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #9 –
Quote from: Peter Edwards –
On whose authority? I don't believe that is true and Alfred's doesn't agree either.

It says

My bad (<<<I don't know why I say that slangy stuff...it doesn't make grammatical sense...)...I believe you may be correct about placing it slightly before.  However, when a dynamic is written amid a series of notes (no rests, bar lines) it is quite appropriate to position the dynamic in line with the note, to save confusion.  Also, there are such cases when this is not possible, and in those cases, the hairpin alignment needs to be adjusted accordingly.

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #10 –
This could help, albeit it's not that aesthetic.

The first note is a RestChord with the quaver rest banished to infinity, and the rest of the bar is padded out with muted headless stemless notes (at an unused pitch). It would have been easier to use hidden notes but that makes the hairpin invisible too!
 

Re: Hairpins present yet another problem...

Reply #11 –
Less clutter if you use a rest despatched in the same direction as the first one!